Horror Movie Talk

The film doesn’t go to great lengths to create a mystery over who the killer is. It is shown early on that the killer is obviously from the same fraternity that Riley’s rapist is from.

Riley stumbles into a secret ritual involving an old bust that is weeping black goo.

If you’re wondering if they ever explain what the black goo is. Don’t hold your breath. It’s bad, and it makes men bad. That’s pretty much the extent of it.

The bust is of the founder of the frat, and apparently he dabbled a bit in black magic and left instructions on how to use said magic (and goo?) to put women back in their place.

It is eventually revealed that the killer is actually killers. The whole frat is out to kill or force into servitude all the women on campus. It’s pretty crazy.

In the end, the women come off victorious.

The Opening

This movie has what I call a strong opening. The very first image, even before the soundtrack plays is a big ‘ol boob. Just one. Taking up the whole frame.

Then it pans back to a frightened Pilgrim woman with chest exposed running away from an unseen terror. When she trips, the villain is revealed.

A demonic turkey utters the first line of the movie:

Nice Tits Bitch!

-Turkie

And then a feathered hand raises holding a bloody axe and comes down killing the chesty milkmaid.

Cultural Appropriation

The legend of Turkie is that he was summoned by a disgruntled Native American to murder the pilgrims. He is essentially eternal, but only kills every 505 years.

In the current generation, Turkie is summoned by his grave being peed on by a dog. Please note that Turkie’s grave marker is a tiny totem pole. This is, I assume, because it is a close approximation of a cross?

The Crew

You can’t get more generic than the horror archetypes in this movie:

• Johnny Football – Johhny
• Nerd Guy – Darren
• Hick – Billy
• Slut – Ali
• Not Slut – Kristen

I make fun, but it’s shocking how even terrible writing and filmmaking is improved with strong and even cliche character types. You may laugh at how dumb the characters are, but at least you know the characters.

Best Scenes

The best scenes are any that involve Turkie. However, the best of these are those with Turkie and Kristen’s father, and then the resulting disguised Turkie that wears the fathers face.

Dawn of the Dead is a pretty barebones movie and as
such, there isn’t much to spoil. People living in zombie hellscape, find mall,
settle down, are overrun by biker gang. “But David, there is so much more to
this movie than just that story structure!” I agree! Most of what Dawn of
the Dead brings to the table is conversation fodder and philosophical debates.
So let’s take a look at some of the more interesting talking points that are
found in Dawn.

We Are Already Zombies!

This is a theme that we are presented with a few times. Why
are these zombies here at the mall? Why are they picking up items and using
them in a vain attempt to act human? Because this is what they know, this is
what is familiar to them. When you boil that down, what these zombies knew
before death was just going to the mall and buying stuff, the real terror
starts to set-in. We are just slaves to commercialism!

Our very purpose is to consume what is put in front of us
until we die and have to eat brains! Ok, maybe not that brains part, but still.

What’s even scarier is that our four alive protagonists do
the same damn thing! They play in the mall and have a great time until the
novelty wears off, and they start to fall into the rut of mall life. And then
the marauding biker gang came. C’est la vie.

The Death AlleGORY

Zombies take what scares us the most, and shoves it in our
face in the form of an insatiable horde who wants us to join their ranks. They
force us to look at our fear of social collapse and civil unrest.

Unruly mobs scare us. Social unrest scares us. Death scares
us.

Zombies are the personification of all of these things. They
force us to deal with these issues face to face.

The Death Reality

Dawn of the Dead forces us to deal with the real life
issue of death as it enters our life. What do I mean by this, and how is it
different than the death allegory? I mean the fact that at some point in every
single zombie movie you are invested in the protagonists, and at least a few of
them become zombies that the group has to “deal with”. The protagonists turn,
against their will, into the antagonists.

And once you realize that, you place yourself in that
position, often with a group of friends or family members and you ask yourself,
“Could I do it? Could I put down my friend/lover/parent?”

The Strategic Mind of Zombie Preppers

Look – if you haven’t found someone to talk about strategy
and tactics for the eventual zombie apocalypse, just hit me up! This is one of
the best parts of zombie movies, figuring out how you would handle yourself and
your family in the event of an outbreak. I’ve reached such a fevered pitch in
this arena that I am actually outfitting my truck to be able to double as a
zombie bug-out vehicle (if you talk to my wife, it’s a family camper) for just
such an occasion.

Dawn of the Dead does a great job of taking the “what
would you do” portion of the zombie problem and taking it to the extreme right
away. Well, first off, you have to think about your party. You need good cohesion
and morale, and it helps to have some people who know their way around
firearms.

Next, you need a diverse array of skills. We are talking
about people who can pilot a helicopter, who maybe have a CDL for handling
those big semis with double clutches and people who know their way around
communications equipment. Dawn of the Dead gives us all of that.

Finally, we need someone who understands how to fortify a structure or location for optimal living in a zombie-infested world.

Dawn has all of the above in spades.

Seriously, if you want to talk about zombie tactics, please
reach out to me on this site or any of our social media.

Differences Between the Book and the Film

The start out, I wanted to talk about the differences between the book The Shining, and the movie The Shining.

• Dick Halloran
  • In the book, Dick Halloran lives and ends up being instrumental in saving Wendy and Danny
  • In the film, Dick gets pretty much instantly murdered, and only helps circumstantially by bringing up the snow cat.
• The Overlook
  • The hotel is a real entity in the book, it is very literally trying to consume the Torrence family
  • In the film, the hotel seems to be haunted and there are hints that it is steering Jack, but the connection between Jack’s psychosis and the hotel is unclear.
• Tony
  • Tony in the book is Danny’s “imaginary friend” that talks to him and shows him things. But really, Tony is a spirit that is more of a guardian angel.
  • In the film Tony is… What is tony? He seems to be Danny’s subconscience or a spirit possessing him… or something.
• Hedge Animals (The one welcome change)
  • In the book, there were a bunch of topiary animals that would move and eventually attack Wendy, Danny, and Dick.
  • In the film, the hedge animals don’t exist, but there is a hedge maze, which figures into the ending.
• The Ending
  • In the book, Jack is distracted by trying to kill his family and forgets to release pressure from the aging boiler in the basement. As a result, the boiler explodes, ripping a hole through the Overlook, and causing it to be burned down to the ground.
  • In the film, Jack gets lost in the hedge maze and freezes to death.

Differences in the Doctor Sleep Movie/Book

The differences are very interesting given that a sequel to the book and a sequel to the movie were created.

So the sequel to the book The Shining includes Dick Halloran being a personal mentor to Danny, and the Overlook no longer existing.

The sequel to the movie uses the source material from the book sequel, but doesn’t have the physical presence of Dick, and does have the Overlook still standing in it. Considering the problems that presents, Mike Flanagan does a great job.

It goes without saying that Jack Nicholson is fantastic in this film. He is 100% Jack.

Shelly Duvall is also iconic in this film. She is also the weirdest proportioned human being on film imo.

The Good Bits

There are a few shining moments in this film, where people act like humans. They are:

1. Wendy speaking to the pediatrician, and
2. Dick Halloran speaking with Danny about the shining.

Music is also a huge part of what makes this film work. The score is filled with mid-20th century composers like György Ligeti , Krzysztof Penderecki, and Béla Bartók. The aleatoric music of Penderecki has in particular become the de facto style of modern horror films.

The Confusing Parts

I still have questions about this film. I’ve read the book, which filled in most of the gaps, but really it’s a completely different story. So here are a few things that I still don’t understand what Kubrick was going for:

• What causes Jack to go insane?
• What purpose do the ghosts serve in the hotel? To be spooky?
• What’s up with Tony? Is Danny Possessed? Is it Danny’s Subconcience?
• The sexual stuff… why? 
• Why does Dick come back?
• Why is Jack in that photo at the end?

So really, my beef with this movie is that there isn’t a lot ofconnective tissue, or rather, it does a really bad job of answering “why” things happen.

This episode of horror movie talk is brought to you by better get help dot com. If there’s something interfering with your happiness or preventing you from achieving your goals, better get help. Online counseling can help. They offer license professional counselors her specialized in issues like depression, anxiety, relationships, trauma, anger, rage, seething hatred, family conflicts, hallucinations, LGBT Q matters, grief, homicidal psychopathy and more. You’re gonna get help on your own time and at your own pace, and anything that you share is absolutely confidential. And if for some reason you’re not happy with your counselor or if you end up killing your whole family, you can request a new counselor at any time at no additional charge. Best of all, it’s truly affordable for our listeners who use the special code HMT a checkout. You’ll receive a free act sharpener mail to you when you sign up so get started today. That’s better. Get help dot com Hello and welcome to horror movie talk and opinionated and accidentally funny Horror Movie review Show your panel of expert hosts each week are Dr Bryce Hansen, who holds a phD in spook ology, and Professor David Day, the foremost expert on scare. No nose. New theatrical releases always get priority. But we also review older horror movies both good and horrible. I’m Bryce Hanson, and I’m Davide. And we have a special special special guest today. Our friend Aaron Hanson, our friend. Aaron. How are you doing, Aaron? Doing good. Thanks for Kevin. How dare you? Bryce knows I have a new toy, and he’s being the the child that we all know he is and denying the use of it. He’s not gonna allow me to do my my my sound effects. Yeah. So we’re gonna have a lot of clips today because David has has his computer set up now drops. Oh, we’re at risk of too much entertainment. No, no. Watch out. Is the fun patrol. Okay, so, uh, we’ve got a great episode today. I’m super excited about this one. Before we get into it. Let’s talk about our website. It’s at horror movie talk dot com. Please go there and you’ll find past episodes and posts and block post of a horror movie topics and also links to our social media. You can follow us on Facebook. Twitter, instagram, tic tac picked on YouTube you to Lincoln Din. Just search for horror movie talk or horror movie talk podcasting. He’ll find us there. We post new episodes every Wednesday. So please subscribe and leave a rating on iTunes. We’re trying to get up to 200 ASAP, and we’re at, you know, 48 right now. So, uh, you ready? If you leave a rating that it is a big impact on our visibility. So what are we gonna talk about? We’re gonna talk about the Shining. Have been So I’ve been so like, excited for and dreading this episode because Bryce Bryce is not a a cubic fan, and, uh, I don’t know. I’m just I’m just worried. I’m just worried about how this will go. Don’t worry. Okay. Ah, we’ll start out giving a brief review and our score for the movie. We score on a scale of 1 to 10 1 being a miserable dredge where it makes you angry. Five being an average film that hits all the expected marks and 10 being so good it transcends genre boundaries. After we give our score will get into spoilers and take a deeper dive in one into what we liked and hated about the film. Um, you know, it’s the shining. So if you’re if you’re worried about spoilers, yeah, I mean, you know, really shouldn’t. Why are you listening to this show? Should have watched it by now. Right? It’s been years on kind of What kind of pathetic person hasn’t seen the shining It? I mean what? I mean, no one in this room, right? Yeah. We’ve all seen the Shining. Yeah, later will be doing a couple special special bits. I’m really excited about this one we’re going to do it came from social Media, where we’ll read a couple comments from our social media feeds on people reaching out to us. And then, yes, it returns horror or porno. Theo. The last time we played this, Aaron was also a special guest on the show. That was for the already or not show. You’ve done this on purpose. There’s one or two things happening either either. I mean, either the porno is following Aaron around or she’s bringing it here with this thing is not the case. This is just basically the only thing that gets us in the mood anymore. Is that your movie or a porno on the podcast. Yeah, You gotta listen to this Really necessary for a relationship at this point, those screams and suffering, and then you just like it’s time to go. So if you’ve never listened a horror porno the game before, buckle up and we definitely earn are not safe for work. Yeah, connotation. Yeah. This is a great game. I’m very excited. Now. You just do it when I’m on so that you know, I can’t recommend it to any of my friends. Yeah, exactly. Well, I don’t know. Maybe still recommend. Yeah. See, that’s one of the problems with me sharing the podcast with my network on Facebook because it’s all just chock full of Mormons. It’s like, Well, I’m got, like, 500 friends that are Mormon and, like the story that are not you say that like it’s a problem. But Utah has the biggest porn porn usage per of any state in all of the United States. Is that true? That is 100% true, according to Pornhub statistics. Interesting. Yeah. So this week we watch the shining, and it’s pretty good. Hello. Oh, wait. What? Really? Here is the trailer. I don’t suppose they told you anything in Denver about the tragedy we had up here during the winter of 1970? Well, a man named Charles Grady is the winter caretaker. He came up here with his wife and two little girls think Muddy. From what I’ve been told me, he seemed like a completely normal individual. But at some point during the winter, he must have suffered some kind of a complete mental breakdown. Ran a muck, killed his family with an ax. You can rest assured, Mr Own. And that’s not gonna happen with me. Yeah, sure. Yeah, I guess so. For some people, solitude, isolation, Johnny the Shining is available to rent on most streaming platforms. But if your horror movie fan, you should probably have this on DVD line around anyways. It’s the shining, right? Yeah. Um, so let’s give it snaps. The Shining is a tale of an aspiring writer, Jack Torrance, played by Jack Nicholson, taking his wife, Wendy, played by Shelley Duvall. Hello. I’m Shelley Duvall on and, uh, thanks, Shelly. She’s a special guest today, and, ah, his son Danny played by some kid named Danny, and he takes them to the Overlook hotels. It lies secluded deep within the heavily forested mountains of Colorado. He’s hired to be the caretaker of the Overlook in the winter off season. While there, he intends to write the next Great American novel, whose protagonist is worn down by the pressures of capitalism and the lack of leisure time. Meanwhile, Danny Torrance is tutored by a magical Negro about Danny’s ability to see into the future and read minds. Also, the hotel is haunted and Jack goes crazy. Do you really not know what the plot of the shining is? It’s the shining. It is that. Is that true? I’m just a little taken aback by your usage of of, um, the word, uh, the shining. No, that’s a trope. The magical Negro. You never heard of that before? No. Yeah. You need to defend yourself immediately. Well, yeah, like the legend of Bagger Vance. Like where it’s or driving Miss Daisy where you know, white people are. You have all these problems and their life is out of order. And then some super folksy African American person enters their life and solved all their problems and teaches them how to love again, or something like that. Oh, so it’s a trope. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. But also, he is magical. And he is a Negro. That is, it’s the most direct A representation of that trophy there could possibly be. I’m sad that the the joke fell flat of the of the novel. I’m gonna be honest. Whose protagonist was worn down by the pressures of capitalism in the lack of leisure time. Well, I mean, man, I love this movie so much. Uh, there’s so many different things about this movie that All right, calm down. Okay, here we go. I appreciate this movie. It is one of the It is one of Kubrick’s masterpiece is It’s visually stunning and meticulously crafted. It’s undeniably a great and important movie. I just don’t like it proves you it’s slow. The characters are empty shells of people that lack most semblance of humanity and motivation other than a to be scared or B to be menacing. And to be frank, I couldn’t figure out what was going on or why. Most of the time the book was better. Come at me, horror fans. I don’t like your pressure shiny. Wow. I mean, it’s just it’s It’s I mean the real lesson to learn in this show is it’s OK to be wrong, which is which is to say that everybody’s taste is very different and and sometimes we get people who are very angry at us. And you come at us about very strange things that are like they’re like, What? What? What was It was the guy, The guy I really liked the curse a la Llorona, but hated like terrified. And it was like terrified is objectively terrible movie. But the curse of La Llorona, though wow, really itch on my body was scratched up. OK, you fucking lunatic. He was He was really concerned for people that would listen to our show and take our advice and not see the curse of law. You’re ona that he thought, like we’re leading people away from really great or movies, which is fair. He’s got a different taste in us. Yeah, he’s like you. He’s just like you. You know, I liked watching like Siskel and Ebert back in the day, and I always disagreed with him, always disagreed with both of them. Like a lot of the time. I would usually disagree with critics when I was growing up, Um, so I mean, I don’t feel bad about it, but when it gets to vitriol when they’re like, these guys are fucking idiots. How dare they not like, first of all, your own? A. That’s just so telling of them, you know? I mean, it’s it’s just a taste thing. Yeah, it’s just a taste this anyways, the shining is terrible way. What did you give it? Oh, yeah, we gotta give the score. I give it an eight out of 10. Fight me. That wasn’t terrible. Yeah, that doesn’t sound like someone. I mean, it’s a good movie. It’s, you know, it’s a classic. It’s visually stunning. It’s amazing to watch in terms of filmmaking and craft, but storytelling leaves much to be desired. Seen my opinion? Seems so, uh, this movie. I feel like this movie’s responsible for my taste in in horror. Yeah, it’s hugely influential to and and I watched it when I was very young. Ah, it may have been one of the first. It may have been the first horror movie I ever saw, and, um, and and there was so much about it that was mysterious and vague and And that in and of itself was creepy to me. And not only creepy, but like, titillating like it made. It made me think about it, all that, you know, it may be like, Oh, what was that? What? What was that? What was that? And so you go back to the movie hoping that you you get something more from it, and but and in each time you would. But he would still be mysterious and in clinical and cold and weird. And it’s just it’s what I love Now you know, it’s almost like it. It recreates that feeling of when you’re a kid and you’re seeing something that’s inappropriate and you just cannot process it or understand it exactly. Even as an adult, it’s exactly that you watch it and you’re like, I don’t understand what’s going on. Yeah, yeah, it’s just this is just this vague wash of like terror and unease and just like Whoa! Hey, what? Wait a minute. What the fuck was that like? And then it really builds into and the music killed me as a kid, like it was like, you know, all those strings and all, and just so much intensity with the heartbeat and like, yeah, so what do you give it? Oh, this is the most solid 10 I’ve ever given, Aaron. Um, well, it is purpose that eyes this. This is the first time you’ve seen way Watched it days ago, three days ago, I had never seen it. I mean, I’ve seen clips and parodies, and but I have seen it start to finish, but yeah, it was. I mean, I can see why it’s beloved by so many people. And at the same time, I there were a couple moments. It’s story wise that I kind of shook my head and it’s like, Well, that was abrupt and there was no really leading to it Other than foreshadowing liken our previous. But I don’t know, it’s I’d say filmmaking wise brings it up a notch for me, just the mastery of it. So I’d probably say, nine out of 10 9 being the reflection of like there I feel like there should be a clear like story that, if that that you should at least understood. Even if you don’t understand what’s happening, you should understand the character’s motivations for what’s happening or you understand their motivations. But you don’t understand what’s happening. And I don’t think either one of those things occurred. Yeah, and we should. We should also mention that for those of you who aren’t who haven’t listened to Aaron, she’s been on a few episodes. I think you were on hereditary. And then also ready or not, Yeah, Hereditary was just like a special interview. She she wasn’t on the regular podcast, most of it. And Aaron is, of course, prices wife, and she is not a big horror fan. So she it’s like pulling teeth, getting her to watch a horror movie. So the context of getting her to watch the shining was that she saw a trailer starring the dreamy Ewan McGregor on She was like, Well, I got to see Dr Sleep So I want to see that which is on the face just completely shocking to me. I had to like I had to just dragger to see Interview with the vampire like that is the level of discomfort. Wait, what was in that movie released in 1994. Yeah. Oh, wait. Yeah, I was like, I was just really like she really dislike score movies you took. Wait, you took Aaron to see Vacher make her watch. Okay? He said he said, drag her too. So I was like, What? Have you guys drag her to the living room for ever? Um, what was the so anyways? The context was she wanted to see Dr Sleep, and she felt like she needed to see the Shining to understand it, which you don’t. But I definitely jumped at the opportunity to get her to watch the Shining so she could be on the episode today. Yeah, in terms of in terms of just being scared or feeling, feeling worried and that kind of thing as someone who’s not really a horror movie fan. How did the shining hit you? Um well, I think I was kind of ruined by, you know, 39 years of parody and endlich clips. But, um, I mean, the most shocking part is when Jack is like full psychopath mare, and that’s like the only thing you see it from the movie. I don’t know. The movie is so disconcerting to me. It’s It’s like I don’t know. There’s something so strange about a little kid riding around in a big, empty hotel and then he likes stops. And then the blood gets off the elevator and you’re like, What the fuck was that? No, that was It was definitely disturbing. And, um, I think there’s more instead of frightening, it was more just disturbing and uneasiness and then seeing the I won’t say a descent into madness because it was a hard left hand. But the, uh I mean, just seeing, like the setup for it and then the super weird sex scene with the dead person and are almost sexy. And I should say And then I don’t know, it just seemed like make out. We’ll talk about it later. But it wasn’t it wasn’t frightening. Yeah, I mean, she she didn’t really? Well, yeah, it’s not a movie that a non horror movie person would hate because it’s it’s pretty. Well, here’s that’s pretty tame compared to hereditary. Here’s the thing, Though. Internet Aaron has always done well. Yeah, in my experience with hereditary. No, she’s great. It’s just she just does not like the feeling of being scared. Of course. Does not like the feeling of dread. Yeah, like she does not like living there. Yeah, and that’s just my entire life. So, yeah, it’s like going It’s like wrapping myself in a warm blanket. Warm embrace. Yeah, All right. So let’s ah do mineral real quick. Um, if you want to support the show and we hope you d’oh, we go through great time of an expense toe. Try to bring a good product. We have a patriotic account. That’s where you can support us most directly. Any amount you pledge goes right back into the podcast to make it a better show for you. We have several tears that allow you access to exclusive bonus content, including early access to episodes as soon as we edited him. What? Which is, like, 22 or three days earlier, like this. Like this Last this last week for Dr Sleep, I I got it out day we recorded Saturday of ahead of time, Um, as well as in an entirely separate podcast called the After Pod. That’s only Oops, sorry. Waving around. Just stick your late ing and knocking Mike’s over. Um, the after pot is just a separate podcast where we leave the mike’s running and talk about behind the scenes info and what’s going on in our Lives at horror movie talk. Another way you can support the podcast is if you ever do you ever shop on amazon dot com. Have you heard of this website called amazon dot com? I got five things coming to me today. They’ve got everything we know you’re gonna shop in a hands on anyway. So if you go to our website horror movie talk dot com and click on the green button in the header of our website that says Shop on Amazon a portion of any of your Amazon purchase or, you know rental anything expand on Amazon will go to horror movie talk. And it’s not minute. It’s enough to make it worth your while to do it. Yes, so please, please do that. Don’t believe that it’s a small, little, half a cent sort of thing. It’s not. Yeah, um, so if you’re gonna buy or rent a horror movie after listening to the pod, click through the button in the banner shudder dot com is a streaming service for horror aficionados, and our listeners get a special deal. If you use code HMT it, check out. You’ll get a 30 day free trial instead of the standard shitty, godawful seven day free travel. You get that seven day free trial. You are a moron. Yeah. What do you think about seven day free trial? It’s Ah, it’s dumb. Yeah, that’s what we have. A little bit more higher than that. It’s bad. All right, Thanks. Thanks cc. Where we don’t have also check out our resident artist, Dustin Goebel. He is a professional artist who fucks hard. David wrote this copy. I altered it a little. Please follow him on instagram at D Goebel 00 d g o e b e l 00 to see some of his fabulous work. If you’re a horror fan, you won’t be disappointed. He also takes commissions for artwork from horror movie talk fans or from anyone. If you reach out, you can reach out to him at D Goebel 00 on instagram and make your artistic dreams come true. Tell him HMT sent you. Yeah. You can also check out his Web site, dustin global dot com. And you know what? He’s got some great taste. He was giving me some some advice. On what? On things I need to watch. Like cinematically Thea Other day I was talking to him and he said, You absolutely need toe. Here’s Here’s the things the two things he gave me He was like, You absolutely need to watch the raid to which I think is a Thai movie. Or maybe is that a horror movie? I think that’s an action. It is not a horror movie. It is an action. When he’s like we were talking about Commando and I was like, I action movies and he was like, Yeah, but the raid to this is the best action movie you’ll ever see. The camera works amazing. So I gotta watch that. And then and then also berserk. The the enemy Siri’s from the nineties, I believe, which was a mango thing anyway. So check out dust and he’s got some great stuff. Yeah, let me adjust this thing here real quick, so he does a for each of the posts for the last, like, a month and 1\/2 fish. He’s He’s created a custom artwork for it, and they’re all awesome. I especially like the lighthouse, one where he has bird characters with Siegel shit on him. And what’s the other really funny one that he did the pumpkinhead one with the Yabba Pumpkinhead one was with earbud was that that was great. It was better than that movie dessert. Yeah, it was good. So thanks again for listening and let’s get into spoilers. First of all, we just watched Doctor sleep, too. So that’s the context of this whole thing is that Dr Sleep was coming out. We wanted to shining before it. We usually do. You know the source material, like the original movie if there’s a remake coming out or the original if there’s a sequel coming out and we looked out and there was, ah, Week advanced screening for Dr Sleeps and now we’re doing the shiny Yeah, not that you care about any of this information, but that’s what it is. So let’s talk about first the I guess only I will be talking about this, but the movie versus the book okay for the Shining. Yeah, and we can even talk about the book versus the movie Doctor sleep because there’s a lot of crossover that’s interesting for people that are going to Dr Sleep this week. Aren’t yeah next week or whatever. So the main difference is in, I think the Shining is like Stephen King’s best selling work. Yeah, I think it is the one thing that got him. No, I guess the Kerry probably got him the most attention. I think that was the first, like, really big one. Yeah, maybe. Yeah, maybe. But I think the Shining is his number one book. Yeah, ever. And I’ll tell you after I watched the movie, you know, I didn’t I watch The movie is the first time as an adult, So I was in my twenties at least, and I was kind of underwhelmed or just like I. It’s one of those things where you get told something so important over and over again that when you watch it, it could never live up to it. But mostly I was confused. Yeah, and that’s like the taste it left in my mouth. And then I listened to the Audio Book of the Shining and it filled in all of the gaps. I was like, Oh, yeah, it made me see the movie in a different light and I started understanding right that Stanley Kubrick was telling his very own story. He was telling his very own story, but also telling it in like the vibe of it like that. He’s telling the story of seclusion and claustrophobia and insanity with vibe with with vibe and visuals but none of like the establishing story. It’s the same reason why you could never understand. I still don’t understand what the end of 2000 won is supposed to mean a fucking lord of 2001. It’s just he’s a visual artist, but he doesn’t necessarily tie it to a story or like conveying information other than look at how cool this looks look and listen like it’s all looking. Listen stuff, Yeah, So watching the shining and listen listening to you describe like how the book fills in gaps. Um, like, reminded me of reading 2001. A Space Odyssey think is in seventh grade and then watching the movie after we read it in our science class and you read the Shine, the Shining No. 4001. I apologize and uh huh. And still what? Well, it was okay. The teacher, like I walk in on parent orientation night and you know, the whatever orientation night, and he’s got like, various versions of the Enterprise models hanging from the ceiling and Star Trek. The next generation is playing cause it’s six o’clock and it’s on the TV. So anyway, so this is all coming in the front. So we read 2001 and then we watch the movie. And even like at that time, when we were discussing the book, he talked about how Kubrick was not necessarily making an adaptation. He was making a companion right to the book. So, um, I kind of feel like maybe that’s what he was like Maybe doing maybe he was making a companion to the Shining the book, but also, I guess he changed it a lot to make it his own. Yeah, there’s definitely so I think probably one of the best people to explain this is Stephen King himself. I have a clip of Stephen King. I don’t know if you know this or not, but Stephen King hate this movie like he absolutely hates Kubrick. Virgin of the Shine, which blows me away because this because it’s widely regarded to be maybe maybe one of the best horror films ever made ever. Right and use, You know he’s fair. But all of these points that Stephen King makes about Kubrick Shining are all completely valid to me. Like it totally valid, but explains why. Um, I prefer the book over over the movie. Anyways, here’s here. Stephen King talking about his take on the Shining The movie in the novel Shining Jack Torrance is a difficult character, but he’s fundamentally a sympathetic character, and I always visualized him is a piece of metal that’s bent 1st 1 way and the other by these malignant spirits who basically want Hiss son because his son is a psychically powerful person. So I saw these always warm characters characters that were being threatened by forces from without, from ghosts from riel supernatural creatures. And the film is extremely cold. Stanley Kubrick saw The haunting is coming from Jack Torrance from the Jack Nicholson character, whereas I always saw it from outside. So we had a fundamental a difference of opinion about, and I always thought that really difference between my take on it and Stanley Kubrick’s take on It was this. In my novel, the Hotel Burns in Kubrick’s movie, the hotel freezes. It’s a difference between more coal, but the images are striking, there’s no doubt about it. I mean, Jack Nicholson’s face in the doorway, his bearded, crazy printing face says, Here’s Johnny, which was his ad lib, and it became, you know, part of the movie. So the images is striking. But to me, that surface, it’s not substance. So I used to describe the Shining. The film is something like a beautiful car that had no engine in it. This this is so like this is so perfect to me like that. I love that I love. I love everything, Stephen King says. I hate everything he writes typically, but But I mean, the dude like I’ve said it before, did like Amazing Powerhouse of a writer. He’s a great storyteller. Yeah, here’s the thing. A great storyteller. It’s interesting to me that still, he can’t see this as art inspired by art like he’s so wrapped up in his own art that he like that he’s that he’s mad about the story being told in someone else’s. Aren’t that was inspired by Hiss? Yeah, I mean, yes, but it has. The only problem is probably has the name The Shining. It’s one of the most important books for him personally, probably because not just because it’s one of the best selling, but also it’s a pretty personal tale about alcoholism. Yeah, and being a writer and basically peeing on the edge of insanity because of, you know, disease and outside, you know, forces, supposedly And um, yeah, I mean, I would even go this far. It’s Stephen King said that the ending was the difference. Is the book the hotel Burns? I’d say, Instead of the hotel freezes and Stanley Kubrick’s It’s Jack Freeze like that, it really shows the focus of where the story is because in the book it’s It’s the hotel itself has power, and it’s trying to consume the family very literally Night and in the movie. It’s all about Jack Torrance and his inner demons. And then, in the end, it’s just it shows him him dying. And in the book, it’s the hotel dine. So it’s it’s kind of interesting that way. Yeah, I mean, it’s you can’t deny that this movie is very cold. Oh, yeah, absolutely not. Not not just literally, but emotionally. It’s very cold and detached. Yeah, absolutely. And but I mean, you know, and it’s But it’s, you know, I’m I’m an adult child of an alcoholic and and and I experienced alcoholism as a child. And I know that everybody, you know and I’ve talked to many kids or people who have also gone through that, and everyone’s experience is so similar, but also so different, you know, and it’s all. And I mean, maybe that’s just, uh, you know, maybe it’s just speaks to Maybe Q bricks. Experience with alcoholism was very different than kings. Actually, I’m sure it was because because they’re very different people. Yeah, but I knew it was even that the alcoholism is a much bigger part in the book, like it’s a main story point that it’s a source for the reason for why he is watching the Overlook Hotel because he got fired from his teaching job are like lashing out at a student. There is less alcohol in the movie then, then we’ll and it also explains it in the in the book. There’s no alcohol like he’s not consuming alcohol, but he’s acting like right. He is because the hotel is basically getting him drunk off of its off of its power. Um, so a couple things to talk about people that are interested in What’s the difference between the book and the movie The Shining and Dr Sleep? We can talk. I can talk about it briefly together cause I listen to the audio book for both, and I’ve watched both. Now the main differences are in the shining Tony, and this is one of the really confusing parts for me when I first watch it like, What exactly is Tony? Is it something possessing Danny? Or is it Danny Subconscious? Where? It was my impression, just from watching the movie that it was that it was the shine within Danny. Yet in the book, it’s much more specific. Tony is an actual spirit that communicates with Danno, so it’s It’s an imaginary friend that is, apart from Danny and Danny can see and talk with, and that’s that’s how it works, Okay, and then the in the movie, it’s like what? It’s Danny talking in a different voice mints like he’s make believing. It’s like he’s doing a puppet show. It’s like he’s fucked up to begin with. So you’re not it’s not. It’s not detached from Danny at all, right? It is so it’s somehow integrated into Danny. But really, it’s supposed to be his imaginary friend. That’s actually a ghost. Another one, this is Ah, this’d probably a good choice on Stanley Cooper. Expert Big part in the novel was these hedge animals. There is no hedge maze. But there was these hedge animals out in the front, and the hedge animals attacked like and it was all sweetie. The biggest part of menace was these hedge animals. Well, it was really creepy in the book. Like it was used to great effect in that they be like that. Did that hedge animal just move? Did it? Didn’t just start looking at me. You’re talking like topiaries or bushes, okay? And, uh, I’m sorry, Topiaries. She just She just listened to Dr Sleep, and she put me on blast for calling her out for saying u N z a U N. And, uh, her audio book e wing is what he prefers to be called. She’s It’s okay. It’s not your fault. You in your fucking buddies. It’s not your fault being Scottish in Norwegian, us, Welsh and Irish and British like we know. What’s up? Hey, I am Well, you’re Scottish English. I’m all that. And I just say, E wing, Yeah, you in that? Your your snooty and, uh and, uh, condescending. Yeah, And I’m like, Ah, that guy got nothing. The other changes that we’ve already explained. The hotel burns at the end of the book the Shining, which is difficult because in Dr Sleep the movie, you have to adapt a source where the hotel doesn’t exist. Well, so they hotel still exists in the movie, Doctor sleep on dhe, then the other main differences. Dick Hallorann survives in the book. I’m in the movie he’s murdered. So if you’re if you’re Mike Flanagan adapting Dr Sleep and Dr Sleep, the book exists in a world that Dick Hallorann is still alive and mentoring Danny and the Overlook Hotel no longer exists. It gives you some interesting, but I thought that they dealt with it really well. You would not be ableto notice that anything was out of place, the way he handled Dick Hallorann and and the hotel. And I think the hotel in Dr Sleep was very satisfying in the ending. And basically, if you if you know the books, you see that the ending of Dr Sleep. The movie is basically the same as the end of the shining. The book. Yeah, right. Yeah, it’s not being left with shining cue bricks shining on and then having to do Doctor a doctor sleep movie would not be terribly hard because they did leave the hotel intact. And so now you can just have an intact hotel to go to and be spooked out in and then and then blow up. Okay, so that’s enough about the books in the movies. Um, Jack Nicholson is 100% Jack Nickle sentence. He’s full, Full Jack. It’s creepier. I know, right? I really I really love. I was gonna share this leader, but I’ll jump the gun and just share this clip about, um, this isn’t what Ari asked Ari Astor says about the Shining, which is an interesting take Hey mentioned specifically about Jack, the character to which I agree with a SZ for his atmosphere is concerned. Like the Shining was, you know, it was a big one. I kind of I think the Shining is almost more, but it works almost for me more as a comedy than it does a horror film What’s that? You got technical cities like crazy from the beginning, before they even get up to the hotel like he’s ready to kill his family well before he even gets the job you want was being taken on. And then you have, like the title slamming into Monday and Wednesday. He’s gone totally insane. Three days then it was important to me to sort of sustain this doom laden tone where you know something awful is coming. So yeah, he is wrong. It doesn’t happen in three days, but yeah, it’s in the movie. It jumps forward a month, and it’s basically the same. And then Jacko’s and saying within like, three days. But I agree with him like if you if you watch Jack on the car ride to the Overlook, he’s basically like, I want to take this fucking car off the road. I’m gonna give everybody here. Yeah, he’s When you look at Jack Nicholson, you just always assumed that he’s insane. And a psychopath who are on this earth, or at least just supremely sarcastic right. I like he gives off this. He gives off the vibe of like, I get fucked every night. You know, like and twice on Sundays And, like, just and it’s it’s It’s it’s like, ominous, you know, he’s just he’s got that. It’s like super straight Tom Cruise, you know? What are you insinuating? I don’t know if they both have this weird striking to give anything more straight than Tom Cruise. My apologies. Have you ever seen risky business? So, um, Shelley Duvall is the weirdest proportioned human being ever. Hey, you be nice to poor Shelly. Jesus. Hello. I’m Shelley Duvall. I forgot she was here. Um, so sorry. Yeah. Shelley Duvall is She’s she’s greatness. She’s in terms of the character existing solely. Toe look terrified. I can’t think of anyone better than Shelley Duvall. And apparently Kubrick borderline tortured that he tortured her to get those react on the side of this movie to make her to basically give her ptsd. Um, not cool. There’s There’s a few shining moments in this no pun intended for me. And one of them is Shelley Duvall. When, when she’s talking with the child psychiatrist, it’s the pediatrician that comes to check on a pediatrician or whatever. So the there’s there’s just two moments that I can point to where humans act like human people. In this movie, one is Shelley Duvall. Talking to the pediatrician and two is when Dick Hallorann is talking to Danny. Yeah, when he’s sitting with him with the ice cream, those areas like, Look, kid, what’s up? Those were the two most like, resonant human moments where people act like normal people. Yeah, and then the rest of it’s just like I don’t understand, Like what they’re feeling or what’s going on internally with them. Well, Shelley Shelley is provide. I would I would argue that that she has a lot of humanity when she’s scared. Yeah, it’s specifically when she like when she finds what he’s been writing this whole time. And it’s just all all all work and no play makes Jack a dull boy at written a 1,000,000 different ways. And then, like in prose and then, like in straight lines and stuff and she’s like, Who? Shit? And then and then he starts coming at her and she’s got the bat and she’s backing up snaking her way through that room, and she’s like, I don’t know, I’m just really confused. I mean, if you if you if you want someone this acting menacing and someone that’s acting terrified, you will be completely satisfied with this movie. But, um, other than mad like Yeah, yeah, yeah, It’s a standard Q Brick. Uh, right tick. And for me, I do love some Kubrick movie is like, I’m not a huge fan where I’m just all upon Kubrick stick for everything. But what your favorite one of my favorite ones are Clockwork orange. Okay, Like, fabulous. And his coldness works in that one. Yeah. Like, absolutely works. Um and then, um, full metal jacket. Oh, Forman. Oh, yeah, Absolutely. But I mean, I consider that, like to movies like the first, the first movie of full metal jackets, like 11 out of 10. What about you, Aaron? Do you dare You fan of any any Q brick films? I’ve only seen the shining in 2001. And what do you think about 2001? I thought it was great. I really liked it. Well, I read the book too, so I understood what’s happening. And then I got this very nice visual presentations. Not already read. Was that Arthur C. Clarke? Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I think that my reaction to 2001 was very similar to my reaction of the shining ones like it’s slow and boring and I don’t understand, Like what the story is supposed to be telling right now. You know, stuff happens. Yeah, and I see stuff happening and it looks great, but I don’t know why I should care. Like my family was big were big cubic fans, and so and they were big, Um, symphony fans like symphonic music like Old Classic And so So by virtue of the fact that, like a lot of his movies, had some amazing tracks, we just end up watching them a lot. And so 2001 was like the most like, another very formative movie for me, where I was like Oh my God, what is this? What’s interesting? Kubrick is very particular about everything, like use super particular, and I don’t know if you know this, But he commissioned a composer to write an original soundtrack for 2001 which does exist like completely new music, and what he did was, he said, the film to he like included tracks. I want the the score to sound like these pieces and So he includes a blue Danube he includes, like all the music that’s in the movie now and gives it to the composer composer it kills. It kills it like there’s a full score and Kubrick listens to it. He’s like, I think I like the blue Dan. I think I just like the songs that I picked better and so use that. But you can Sometimes you see concerts of the actual score that was wow created from the shining So cool. Yeah, if you haven’t watched room to 37 that the Yeah, the 3 to 37 is basically, like the equivalent of 9 11 truthers talking about their obsession with the Shining. Yeah, like Kubrick has a master plan where Look at these cans in the back and see the cans of Cal You meant in the background with the Indian head on it that the Native American head on Yeah, that stands for Western expansion. Literally. That’s literally like something that said in that I watched about, like, 30 minutes and then I’m like, Okay, I get like, these people are crazy. It’s like three hours worth of talk about a two and 1\/2 hour movie. Yeah. Um, the music. We were gonna talk about the music. The music in the Shining is a huge part of the impact of the movie. Great. One of the reasons why a lot of the moments work without the music and without the score, this movie would not be talked about. And I should say, I will. You have mentioned. But when this came out, it was a critical failure. People didn’t like it, really. And I don’t think a lot of people that watch it early on liked it either. Because it was different from anything that was done before. Hugely influential now. But, I mean, it’s really interesting Thio here about movies that weren’t received well when it first was released and now is considered a masterpiece. And sometimes I agree with the original audience. I’m like, Yeah, it’s not back. Great. Yeah, yeah, I mean, but then you got silent night, Deadly night that beat out nightmare on Elm Street first week and then got pulled for being too obscene. Yeah. So, um, the both me and Aaron have music, degrees, bachelors and music, and and a lot of the composer’s that air featured on the soundtrack for The Shine in a recognizable 20th century composers, Penderecki is featured in most of the music, which is, if you think about a horror movie soundtrack, it’s gonna sound like Penderecki. And then he’s, like, legit, considered a classical composer of the 20th century. Like, um, academics and music professors like make students study his music. And it sounds like a horror soundtrack, like in your music history classes, like the string stings like the right and the weird kind of timpani sounds. And I’m so Inger Ceramic Buller, the Water Bowl or whatever it is that they hit. I’m so interested in these artists who choose to live their life in this fucking jar space. Oh, man, like you actually like you should listen to. I know you’re not a huge symphony fan, but Penderecki, there’s, ah, he did that thready, right? What was it but like, but artists like HR Geiger, who, you know, inspired did all the inspiration for alien. And in these binned and apparently Penderecki, who just lives in this audio space of terror of just like Oh my God, this is so horrifying. I know. I need to introduce you to some mid century 20th century classical music because it’s like all the Alia Tor IQ and a tonal stuff. I think that you’re all right up your alley. I love I love like Have you listen any like Scott Walker’s Like It’s So Low Career Oh my God, it’s terrifying. There’s there’s there’s pieces where it sounds where it sounds like like wet meat dripping. And it’s and what it is, is it’s him. He has a holding. What? Meet a stripping. If you haven’t seen 30th Century Man, it’s It’s a documentary about about Scott Walker. He died this year, and, uh, and he for this for the set to make this sound. He got like, this slab this half of, ah, of a pig, and he just was punching it, punching it next to a nice microphone. So one the Penderecki piece that I really like is threatening t to the victims of Hiroshima Symphony number three. That’s that’s a really good one, fits Jesus. As you can imagine, some other composers that we found there’s bar talk lickety licky like and bear Leo’s, um, the producer of the dreaded lickety split. Well, okay, so the very first thing you hear in the shining is the d s here a theme, Um, that dun dun Dun Dun Dun, Dun Dun that’s that is old that is centuries old. That theme and it’s like a chant is It’s It’s a chant, and it’s literally the day of, like, judgment. Damn, yes, Oh, it’s It’s intended to frighten the masses and into submission. And, um, like Bear Leo’s uses it to like, um, kind of evoke, like, satanic kind of dark things in his dream of the witches Sabbath. Like which, if you haven’t heard it, you you probably have heard at least part of it. But that’s like the beginning of the shining when they use the synthesized kind of low brass. Low strings combination is really effective because it’s like an organ. Sound almost sounds as if the size from like an electrical or something like that, and it’s for me. It felt like just the sound of it. The way it’s like designed makes me feel like I’m going through a tunnel like you’re sweeping across this big lake with this helicopter shot. But the sound of the like the quality of sound makes you feel you’re going through a tunnel and it feels very narrow. And then, like contrast that with seeing Dr Sleep. And when they use that theme in Dr Sleep, they’re using, um, low brat like actual low brass and low strings. Um, probably low woodwinds, too. But they they also like, filter it through like digital synthesizing whatever. But it’s. But it feels way more epic, way more expansive. And so you really feel bigger punch. You feel like there’s more at stake. There’s they’re like, there’s something bigger happened. I know I don’t Yeah, I know in the trailer, like when they played d S e r A. And it’s the symphony. You’re like, Yeah, God damn your hackles rise, you know? But you brought up in an interesting point, Aaron, which is there’s a There’s a contract, a heavy contrast going on right here in this big open space. And then and then the sound you’re for you that’s being forced upon you is is confining or constricting. That’s it, then, is that this? This contrast Ah, Kubrick threw in through the whole movie like he’d wanted you to feel uneasy so he would throw in these very contrasting things or turn things around like intentional, intentional in continuity and of where? Where, you know, Maybe he’d be riding his bike one way down the hall, and then and then you cut to another shot from behind him. But he’s writing the same way down, like the opposite way down the hall so it can kind of mess with your head a little bit well, and it’s a It’s a big hotel, too, and it feels big when they first go there. And it’s full of lively people, and everyone’s having fun. And did you know it’s timber? Lilac right here? It’s right next to you, right nearby in the theater for Dr Slave Hunting people, Theo the like. Wide shot is definitely Timberline Lodge, but then, when they get closer shots of the entrance of the hotel, it’s not. No, it’s a different interior. And then and then the interior is completely different. Interior staged sports some other hotel anyway, So what I was saying was like, the hotel is feels big in the beginning, but then, as like the it feels like the walls are kind of closing in as um, you realize what’s happening in this hotel with, like, craziness happening. And then the fear just makes the feel like the walls are closing and even the ballroom scene, like when he first walks in and he goes up to Lloyd, the bartender, Um, like it’s empty. It feels big. But then all of a sudden it’s full of people and it feels like closed in and claustrophobic. And it’s I think that’s a good point. You make about like the contracts. So a couple more points to talk about before I put this movie on Blast even more is a good conversation. Like again, I I appreciate this movie. It’s just not necessarily for my taste. Um, but the one thing that a super appreciate is the torrents family sweater game is on point. Dude, I love your sweaters. They all are just hard core sweater. Yeah, I gotta tell you, I got better. Fam. I got it, I got it. I got this sweater and I will never like there is one of a collection. It will be a collection now because a wool sweater is just comfy all the time. It’s just comfy cozy. It’s a right temp. It lets enough win through That’s enough wind through that. You’re not. You’re not drowning and in heat. It’s great. Yeah. Yeah. David’s wife gave him the dudes sweater. Yeah, from the Big Lebowski. I love it. And at first it was really hard to wear it in public. It was like, I can’t be that guy, But now I don’t give a shit. Yeah, I’m fully that guy Who will do that, do she think? And, uh, Pendleton Woolen Mills is right from the area, which is the maker of the sweater. And Yeah, man, I wish I could by some of their stuff there got wool blankets that air just world renowned. And it’s like $300 for, like, a little square. Yeah. Fun with this. Grow like a throw blanket that will cover. You know, just your legs, the factories hiring right now. I mean, maybe get an employee discount. Um, another one. Just an observation. Jack Torrance is a huge asshole. Like a separate separate from being insane. So yells it, Wendy, Don’t disturb me when I’m writing. Can’t you see that I’m working? And he chooses the most central huge area in the hotel. He’s got the choice of probably like 200 hotel rooms. Least that if they don’t have a desk, you can put a desk in there. It’s a typewriter. He doesn’t need power. Yeah, he’d just sit there. But no, he’s gotta have the gigantic central meeting room that is the hub of the entire hotel. Did he? This is This is why it doesn’t Jack Torrance in The Shining. The movie does not need alcohol to be an alcoholic. It’s so it’s so reminiscent of alcoholic behavior. It’s just it’s just like, Oh yeah, that guy’s in total debt, dipshit. Yeah. Um, okay, so this this is here’s some of my main questions, Um, and my my beast with the movie has talked about a lot of them, but to me, I wrote this down as I was watching it again. This movie has no connective tissue. Or to say it another way. The movie does a really bad job of answering why. So here’s here’s a couple questions that I have that I don’t think the movie does a great job of answering, and it’s it’s stuff that’s not unimportant, not unimportant. So things like what causes Jack to go insane. It’s not super clear in the movie. It is in the book. Right? Um what purpose did the ghost served in the hotel? To be? Spooky. Yeah. Uh, What do you mean, what purpose? What purpose? To go serve outside of a hotel. So Haman What’ll what? I mean, what was specifically what’s the connection between them and Jack going insane? Yeah, like there’s it’s like two separate things were happening once they’re in a haunted hotel. That’s creepy. And they’re ghosts. That will attack Danny, apparently. But also, Jack is going insane. Yeah, there’s no, like, explicit connection. And there is one in the original story, right? Yes. So if you listen to Kubrick and that it’s, you know internal like, then why is Danny seeing him? And why are they attacking him? Like if it’s Jack, If Jack is the evil eyes because alcoholism is genetic people who’s passed down the trade to his child, he’s just a dry alcoholic. Yeah, I don’t I don’t even think Kubrick would say It’s it’s internal either. I think he’s just not. He’s not concerned about the original character and story of the of the Shining. Um, so what’s the the other one we talk about? What’s up with Tony? Is Danny possessed? Is it Danny Subconscious? Um, the sexual stuff. What even is the shining? Yeah. What? Yeah, What is? I mean? They explained that they, like some people, shine. Some people don’t like the you know how you can read people’s mind and see the future. Well, some people can do that, and some people don’t. So I thought those enough of an explanation for the Shining just for the movie because it was just like, Oh, it’s a It’s a special thing. He’s special and he’s special talking about being special and that that works. But it also has no connection to what happens in the movie. That’s just like, Here’s what the Shining is what the movie is named after, Um, and it’s just two special guys just having a talk over some ice cream you. And if you want to know what the Shining is watched doctor sleep because it actually explains it. Yeah, I got to say, Doctor, sleep is is a like if you haven’t listened to our episode about it, we just did it and it was my favorite blockbuster of the year. I think I had kind of a unique experience because I I saw the shining on Wednesday night. And then I saw Dr Sleep on Friday night way exactly. So So like having those like, I only have 48 hours to digest the shining. And honestly, like I had seen a bunch of parodies, you know? Sure. Bits. And she hasn’t seen The Simpsons one yet. Oh, wow. I think I have, like, I think I have. But I don’t have much of an encyclopedic knowledge of The Simpsons. You’ve got an ocean in, boy, that Shin ae yours. So like having having said that like, I only maybe seen like I’d say, probably 1\/4 of the movie The Shining before I watched the whole thing because there was a lot that surprised me like about the movie that was in the movie because I and I never heard of before. Um, the like, the scene with the pediatrician. Uh huh. And, um, like, that’s, like, the best back story that the movie does. It was like that’s like, all the back story that we get. And, um, and the What was the other thing? The oh, the fact that she’s that Wendy is basically doing all the work in the hotel. Like Jack his leg. I got this job because blah, blah, blah, and I have mouths to feed blah, blah. And he’s like like, there is no, like there was no establishing shot of him doing any work, what so ever? And he’s like, It’s my contract, right? I’m like, Dude, Wendy was checking the boiler room. She’s like fixing all the food for your really keeping are really keyed on in on this. Yeah. I mean, lives because of their backs, just like his computer all day long. And then he goes out these days. Shut up here and I’m working. Don’t disturb me when I’m working. I chose the most central room in the house because I need to stretch out. I need to focus on pulling porno clips. Okay. They have to sound just like horror movies. Um, So the other questions are the sexual stuff in this movie. Like why? Why is the it’s it’s sudden they add a such an element of, like, spinning you around. It’s like Whoa, whoa, e. I mean, that was That was great. When, when, uh, Aaron saw the blowjob sequence first. That’s that’s That’s the most confusing part in the whole movie. Like, Whoa, Why is that dog given that butler a blowjob? Mommy, why is the dog on that man’s lap? That was me in 1992. You were the dog. Yeah. No, I was the one saying, Oh, uh, so you and Aaron made the point while we were watching that. That was probably a lot more shocking back in early eighties, you know, just having homosexuality on film. I guess you don’t. I mean, it could have been a woman in the No, no, it was definitely man, are you? I’m telling you that. Are you designing them? A gender? I don’t presume to know what dogs you. Even if I asked him, He is a canine can. But the I mean, that’s that shot when that happens. Like the front known evidence of fairies. Probably not, but, uh, like in 20 watching it in 2019 for the first time, I’m like, Oh, so this is like a rager, like they’re having a great party, and people were breaking off into separate rooms and goes all these ghosts, like, are still keeping the party going, you know, 50 60 years later, and Blake and then I was thinking about it like men in 1980. Just the idea of showing any homosexuality on screen would be terrifying to lots of men, especially, and that would that would just be like, Oh my gosh, you just add to the scariness of everything because homosexuality is so scary. If the Shining was shot in 2019 it just be like 22 Girl goes just way too obvious. And I would be just like two girls, one cup, way to a to Z. Yeah, it’s just way too inappropriate and over the top. Instead of like the insinuation of sexuality, it be like full blown ghost. I don’t know. People are so desensitized. Everything now like I don’t know that there’s any like, sexual thing that they could do that we shocking have toe. There’s a few I know of. A few would have to be violent, just like like the torture scene in it have to have to be like the torture scene in Dr Sleep. What about that guy? What about that guy on the Internet who freezes poop and then puts it in condoms and then uses. Now I know that exist uses it to pleasure. You’re welcome. And then, um, last two questions. Why does Dick come back? That’s not really explain. Just lunch. Especially special election with Danny. Why does Howard and come back? Yeah, Yeah. Danny shots at him with his head. Danny’s like, Ah, the trends Heller. And sitting there in his bed with his two froze porn ladies a bit above his bad and above his TV. And he’s like, Oh, shit, that little boy in trouble. And he’s like, he like, he’s the best. I love Halloran and Scatman Crothers so much in this man. He’s a shining moment in The movie is great is the funnest wonder. What? Well, I mean, I guess, Jack find us one of Jack’s crazy, uh, the less He’s just crazy. The last question is, why is Jack in that photo at the end? Yeah, so I mean, I think that implies that he was always here, like they say that. I mean, they they say that, but what has been the caretaker, right? Like what? It’s thinking like hotel adding a tally mark to the you know, like like we got another one boys, you know, like, I guess, See that that is like the the final image. And it feels like just that weird twist that’s there to be a twist but doesn’t have any sense other than be like, Yeah, well, that means something. Is that Is that mentioned at all in the book like that? He’s been there previously. Or is that just something that Kubrick at it in or that he talked? It was definitely time in. The photo is like from the twenties, so it’s not actually Jack Torrance the character. So I don’t know, maybe I’m not remembering. Maybe there is a photo with a guy that kind of looks at it. So in the book, it’s really interesting that the descent into madness is very attached to Jack’s obsession with the hotel and that he discovers the history of the hotel. He finds these documents in the basement about the history of the hotel, and it’s got a bunch of shady connections with the mob and, um, like money laundering kind of stuff. And he’s like, This is what I can write my book about, and he he reaches out to the manager of the owner of the hotel is like, I want to do my book on all the dirty laundry about the Overlook Hotel. And they’re like, um no, don’t do that. Please don’t do that. And if you do that, you will suffer consequences, Basically. And so ah, lot of his rage comes from his reaction to that to his reaction to the man basically telling him what he can’t do. And it expands out from there. And the his obsession with the hotel in the history, um, really shows the power that the hotel has over him. Um, so, yeah, that’s that’s that’s kind of missing from the movie as well. Um, but the the one part where it does kind of show the hotel as being an entity and a power of itself is the is the character of Grady the butler. When he’s talking to Jack in the bathroom and he’s he’s basically pushing Jack to be like, Well, you know, you got to do, you know, and it’s definitely the personification of the hotel itself and then the other, like a great side care home. Come on and waste your family and give you a beer. That’s right, because that that butler was greedy. But when the when the hotel owner or manager, whatever was interviewing talked about the murder, The Grady murder later. Yeah, he was the He was the caretaker. Yeah. So? So. And then when he tells Jack you’ve always been the caretaker, like, does that mean that Jack was, like, 10 years previous? He murdered and was That’s just great. He he’s just doing it. He’s just fucking with your head, all right? That was too much, too many. Um, And then the other great moment is the bartender. What’s his name? Lloyd Lloyd Lloyd. Bartenders is great. He’s got the greatest dead stare. Yeah, um, and then the That’s the other part. That kind of tells you that the hotel is has a personality, cause when he specifically says, you know, it’s on the house is basically saying like, this is the hotel giving you what you want. Your money is no good. You know, um, anything else that we want to talk about? The shining man? I, uh really Well, first of all, I don’t know. I don’t I don’t know if there’s really a maze. I don’t think there is a maze up a Timberlake? No. Um, but I would really love to find one of these mazes. And that is a like a 13 foot tall maze. It’s amazing. And it’s all No, but that would be a blast to do. First of all, And then second of all, um, I don’t know, I I love I love the more I watched this movie like. Okay, so I got I gotta admit, there is a little There’s a small not totally in substantial part of me that kind of dreads every week having tow watch another horror movie. Especially when I when I’ve already seen. But when I watched the Shining, you’ve seen it The miniseries and Part one and part 20 Anyway, so, yeah, I mean, so there’s a part of me that’s like, Mmm mmm, mmm mmm. I got to get kind of amped up to do these things. And the shining was like, I’ve seen this so many times, but I went back out and I watched it, and it was It was like I got so much more out of it is this time and so I don’t know if you haven’t seen the shining in a while. And you you are a fan. Uh, then, you know, check it out. Because And it’s a great winter movie. Yeah, it’s a good time to watch it too. Since Dr sleeps out like, watch the shining and then go see Dr Sleep. Yeah, it’s very good Companion pieces And later, the very complimentary The stories in two very different styles, but very good. And cover is my favorite director, Maybe of all time. Yeah. Yeah. Godric Coop, Coop Brack. Come blur. Okay. Um so final recommendations, final recommendations. Who should see this movie? Everyone. Yeah, you go first, everyone. Yeah. I mean, it’s not only is it, you know, a good horror movie, it’s iconic. It’s like part of the, you know, lexicon of film. Like you have to see it. Yeah, yeah, I agree. It’s It’s a must see for anyone. It’s one of Kubrick’s masterpiece is It’s one of Jack Nicholson’s absolute best performances ever. Yeah, and yeah, I mean, it’s it’s ah, fantastic filmmaking. Um, you might not. I love it, but it’s worth saying, definitely if you if you listen a horror movie, talk regularly and you want to get, like a good bead on on my opinions on, like the things that I enjoy about horror horror films. This is like a master class in it. This is so similar. Like I it’s been so interesting to do this podcast because I’ve realized so much about my own taste and how it differs from other people’s. And like I enjoyed the killing of a sacred dear so much, so much more than you. It’s because it’s It’s a cube. Rick ask movie. Yeah, that’s true. It’s interesting because we have really similar tastes as well in terms of, like, family based emotional Yeah, horror like you have that to love it. But you love this. Yeah, just as much. Justus much there and this like, um, just in books, all stories. I love them to be cold and clinical and, like, detached And really, there’s something just so mysterious about that to me that I don’t know, just scratches my itches. Okay, so go see it. Go see Dr Sleep too. On. Let’s move on to it came from social media. Yes, it came from social media to fill the world with terror to bring you one forgettable suspense. What was it? Where did it come from? For the all powerful creatures that brought from social media And what did they want? So it came from social media is ah portion of the podcast that we sometimes dedicate to going over some comments that we’ve gotten from Facebook, Twitter, instagram, wherever they’re coming in at us. And this is ah, very special came from social media because I think we need Thio, maybe make some changes to the podcast going forward. Um so Stephen Stephen M. On Facebook just recently you skipped the 1st 1 What’s this friend? And I know I’ll get to that one. So Stephen M on Facebook? I guess it’s Yeah. A couple of days ago Said Just discovered your podcast on Li. Listen to two episodes so far, but really enjoying it, particularly the witch episode. It made me want to revisit a film. I was totally underwhelmed by just one thing. Please stop burping into the mic. It’s fucking disgusting. And as I was doing brother, as I was going through wth e YouTube, there was a comment that I missed from a month ago from Isaiah and I never saw that? Yeah, he said Hot hot tip in capital letters. If you didn’t belch into the mic and slurp drinks like moronic man children, you might get some extra subscribers. I couldn’t get past two episodes on stitcher, and the APP doesn’t let me express my absolute disgust. Get your shit together. You make all horror movie fans look terrible. Do that. That person. Isaiah, you’ve got some anger issues, buddy. And you in there directionless, and you need to take him out yourself. So this is the level vitriol that this is created that he heard it. He found us on stitcher. And he he wanted to tell us so bad that he had to seek us out on another platform to leave a comment that could fully describe his discussed and then way back, going way back into olden times an April 10th Dana see on Facebook. We love you, Dana. Yeah, we love Dana, and she was the original originator of this concern on Facebook. She says, keep doing what you’re doing. Maybe with less belching Ella. Well, this is from one of your female fence. You do have them so moronic, man. Children are our reaction to this request is like some people like it, But I don’t think anyone’s ever commented that they do. Like no one likes it. Let me. Uh Well, I don’t know. They tolerate any. Think you’re someone like me? Let me think. Here. What’s what’s what was the biggest terrestrial radio show ever? Yeah, but we’re no cowards. No, no, I know, but what was it? Oh, yeah, it was Howard Stern. What did they, uh, what do they do all the time? Still, they’ve done it for 30 years. So I’m not saying I’m not saying they’re wrong, That this is their taste. They don’t enjoy it. And you know what? After after Thea. The other thing is that this is the hill that David is gonna die on. No, it’s not a hill. I’m going to die. And the other thing is, I think I think there, there, there, there may be an aspect to this. That is right. It may it may drive people away, but I mean, the other part is I mean, if you listen to comments, you’re gonna have people telling you you’re a Moran on moronic man child for providing them with a free piece of something that they don’t have to listen to you. I mean, it’s it’s Ah, it’s hard not to get your feelings hurt when you called a moronic man child, when you’re tryingto provide a free service, the people they try to put it in a lot of efforts, your silly, but I think it’s a very valid thing that I think early on it was I was more concerned about. Sounds like drinking Mike mouth sounds and like coughing sure and belching into the microphone. And I think, you know, maybe it’s time that we make an effort to class up the place and not discuss our listeners. We’re gonna put it I’m gonna officially say we’re gonna put a moratorium on belching on horror movie talk way Need to be This is this is a partnership. You can’t just you can’t just make it. You can’t just make e. I need to agree to the people. So if you disagree with this moratorium, you have to reach out on on social media and tell us like we love the belching. Do not stop the belching and you need to do you need to put up like an actual demonstration to show that it’s worth keeping because I don’t think we deserve the the privilege of belching into our listeners ears directly because we’re not quite, I don’t know. We’re really close to the quality of Howard Stern Show, but not quite there. So I think if it’s ah, perfectly rational to put a moratorium on belching on horror movie talk, we need to be more considerate and mature for audience. So now let’s play horror or porno whore porn ing. All right, horror. Porno is a game or a partner is a game where we play clips from horror movies and clips from poor nose, and it’s surprisingly hard to predict where they came from cause there’s lots of squelching sounds, screaming passion, you know, it’s really hard to suss him out. So we played this once on Ready or not, it was a really, really delight again on a chapter two. Do we? Oh, yeah, that was twice, Um anyways, so since I didn’t go to the movie last night, I had an extra $10 that I was expecting to spend on a ticket, so I decided to get a to buy some music for intro music. I feel like it deserves it. That’s a good intro. I got to say, Can we just get the 1st 5 seconds of that one more time? God damn, That’s a funky beat. Slaps fucking slap literally. Uh, so it goes without saying that if you’re if you’re sensitive to uh huh. You know, sexually explicit sounds. Or if you’re don’t have this on headphones, rear work may be May be turned off this one. But how we play leave. No, you have to participate. Um, David, can you keep score? So I will play a clip. And you have to tell me if it’s from a horror movie or a porno, Right? And extra points if you can guess the title of either. Okay, extra points, If you can guess the title. So it cz one point, if you guess correctly on the genre. And then it’s another point if you actually get the Yes, right. Okay, first clip. Are you ready? And Aaron is playing too. Yes. Here we go. Clip one. Wow. Okay, So was that a horror or porno? Erin, I say horror. What makes you say that? The the screaming, the music Yeah, Something hard to me. Okay? I don’t I don’t have a guess. It I don’t want to get any given anything away. David. I’m going to say that did sound an awful lot like a horror movie. But there was There was an inordinate amount of squelching and kind of gagging time. It’s hard it could be. Could be gagging. Could be knifes going into bodies. Yeah, yeah, sure. There’s a lot of it, no matter what. There was definitely some plunging involved. Right. Um, so I’m going to say I think I’m gonna say were is Well, yeah, Okay. I get your rational, but you’re both wrong. That is a porno. That was nightmare on Dik Street. Oh, wow. Um, look, clip number two. That seems unlikely. Okay, David Horror, porno. And once you ration out, I’m really gonna have to go. I think that’s definitely a porno movie. Yeah, that’s a partner. That was that. Sounded like a woman getting hammered. No, it sounded like a woman really, really faking that. She was enjoying hers. I mean, regardless, she was getting hammered. Yeah. I mean, see this. This just shows you how hard this game and that was actually no movie. What? Yeah, that was screamed. That was just a dream. I I honestly can’t say that I remember that part. Well, it isn’t like an opera scene. And sky was I don’t remember. It was Drew Barrymore That was seen how that was. That was Drew Barrymore. Yeah. Okay. All right, celery tied for nothing. Anybody for enough? Anybody’s game we’ve got, we’ve got six, and then a tiebreaker if we need it. But you can aren’t doing that. Great. We’ll see if we can turn it around on clip number three. All right. Horror or porno? Aaron, what do you think? Can you take this seriously for, like, five seconds? That is actually, considering We just saw squirrel that it went such That is such a normal thing for me to hear because you watch a lot of horror movies. That’s a That’s a porn. That’s got to be a porn. Okay, David. Okay, now, now, the first thing that comes to mind is porn on this one for sure, Because like I said, it comes comes to my mind no AA lot, but I e think of Aaron and I keep guessing the same than the known has a chance to pull. Right? So I’m going to go against my better judgment and say, That’s a horror movie. That’s clearly a porno. You think that’s a porno? I I do. I believe I think that same thing. But so do you have a guess on the title? Either one of you on the title for the for that? Yes. So you you’re guessing porno. So do you have a guest for the title? I wouldn’t even pretend. Okay, that I could think of something. Um, I guess that could be the bride of Chucky. Okay. All right. So David gets one point. It is a horror movie. That is from the grudge. There it is. Yeah, yeah. No. Yeah, that’s I mean, that’s the those Japanese horrors for you. Yeah. Okay. Clip for Aaron. You gotta catch up. I’m doing that to Mrs Move. Relax. Bastard led us here. Wow. All right, horror, porno, I gotta say, is definitely a horror movie. Okay, David, She said it was tearing me apart. I mean, it shows how how hard it is to choose, because I could work even. Wait. There was a lot of male voices there as well. That’s clearly a horror movie. You think that’s a heart? Be for sure. Yeah. Um, I think it may be a horror movie as well. I’m going to say, In fact, I’m gonna hazard a guess. I’m going to say that was Silent Hill. Okay, Aaron, you gotta guess for your title. Uh, no. I don’t know. No more movies. All right, um, you guys air not close. It is a porno. That was from the bear bitch project. The bear bitch product. That just seems unlikely that they’d name a porno. That but, I mean, you know what? That’s actually not true. That poor nose gets a fucking weird names, Okay? This one is an easy one. This is a total. Gimme it. So you don’t If you don’t know what this is and the title of it Like what are you doing? Okay, Theo. I mean, come on. Yeah. Aaron, I Everyone, everyone knows this let you go first on this one because I’m I’m a I’m a co host on a horror movie podcast. So this is gonna be a hole in one for me, and I feel like, Well, this is definitely a horror movie and I’m I’m pretty sure it’s psycho, but I’ve never actually seen it go. You’ve never seen Psycho never see the next one iconic score like I mean, you can hear you can hear it in that. In that clip Ri ri ri It’s, I mean, that’s as big or bigger than Jaws. You know, like the Jaws Dun Dun, Dun Dun That’s even bigger. And I’m gonna also I’m gonna go with air and say, Yeah, this is the second. This has gotta be psycho. This is how for Titch Cox Psycho? You know, it’s kind of play a trick on you guys that that score is using different places, like appeared on Psycho. And it’s also in Re Animator. He noticed that, but yeah, but I still thought you guys were to God. This is like a classic. It’s the classic adaptation of Bram Stoker’s classic ejaculate, that z you’re living that the horror movie. This is a porno. Yeah, that’s like one of the most It’s a support. Yeah, it’s one of most famous Porn O’s and Ejaculate. Yeah, like seventies. I got to see this like Debbie does. Dallas Deep Throat and Ejaculate Dracula right next to that. Have you seen Caligula? Uh, it’s you have, Uh oh, man. Wow. When did you see that? Oh, yeah. Maybe. Maybe it’s the plan, Caligula. I didn’t think about that. But ejaculate, it’s It’s actually if you watch the movie, it’s based on calculate. Wow. Sorry, guys. Real, real close. I mean, come anywhere. Where? Yet? So you still got one? I got one point in Aaron. Every man, I really thought you would have had it on psych. I thought I had it on a psycho. Okay, so, um, I will try one last time. Maybe Aaron can tie it. Okay. Oh, please only believe Thank you. Oh, wait, please. Oh, apologies. So, horror movie or porno? I got to say that it’s This is definitely I feel like I saw this yesterday. This is definitely a porno. You okay? Yeah. I didn’t need that level of Well, okay, so for the sake of because I think I’m finally figuring out this game, huh? Um, I’m going to say it’s a horror or movie. Okay. Do you have a guess? Is the to the title frozen too? Frozen to isn’t a horror movie, but Good guess it is actually a Disney property. It is hocus pocus. Oh, damn. You know, hocus pocus has I mean, that doesn’t surprise me at all. I get a point. Yeah, Yeah. Get a point. Yeah, we’re tied up. So that means we’re tight, So go ahead, Day. But hocus pocus is commonly confused, right? I mean, when you just separate out the audit with you when you have the visual owned, by the way, did anybody else get in on the pre pre order for Disney? Plus, uh, that’s a good segue way hocus pocus gun beyond there. Yeah, and good, maybe. And it comes out, comes out in two days, 70 bucks, 70 bucks gets you your subscription and like and then your grandfather didn’t know that that plants. Oh, hocus pocus. Super hard to tell whether that’s when it’s just audio, But I don’t remember that scene from the movie. I’m gonna have to watch. You have to watch again. Like Sarah Jessica Parker had a lot of interest, and I mean, you know that meddlers. Yeah, she’s a demon in the sack. I mean, uh, okay, so we need a tiebreaker. Luckily, we have this last clip. So clip number seven. Yeah. Lots of encouragements. Yeah, take it. Get it in, Get it in? Yeah, horror movie or porno? Wouldn’t it be weird to like being I mean, assuming, Like I’m sorry. You go ahead and guess it’s a porno. You think that’s a porno? Yeah, I think this is. This is pretty clearly a behind the scenes clip of a horror movie where they’re where they’re like, they’re practicing their lines and they’re getting, you know, they’re they’re they’re getting encouragement from from the other actors and actresses and like the lighting writing that you’re saying You’re saying a horror movie. I’m gonna say a horror movie? Well, no, it’s It’s a horror movie. Wouldn’t be behind the scenes. It has to be like an actual poor or partner. So your assumption doesn’t I just want to give you the benefit, Okay? That election, it’s gonna mean the actual movie. Okay, then I’m going to say this is, um I’m gonna say this is I’m going to say the ring. Um, you are correct that it’s a horror movie. Oh, so you got you got me there, But it’s actually from Poltergeist 20 Yeah. No, I don’t remember. I think still thinking about it. Do you recall which scene it’s the scene where all the ghosts are together and And there? Yeah. Fucking that. That point start. Yeah. No, Now I remember that. Okay, so David pulls ahead. David wins horror. Porno, which I get shouldn’t surprise anyone. He’s an expert at both. And, uh, thank you for playing Aaron, but you can hang your head in shame You did not know how or and or porn I think I never wanna win this game. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. All right, well, that’s our show for today. Thanks for listening. Please share the podcast with a friend. It’s pretty much the only way we can keep growing and bringing ah, higher quality show to you and, you know, take the time and effort that it in the real sacrifice that it tasted to do the research for this show. And remember to get on social media, tell us you love those belches. You know, if you want to stick around, we’re gonna put a moratorium on him. Unless there’s a public outrage about it, we’ll see. I mean, you know, it depends again. Support the podcast by clicking through the button on the banner to Amazon associates were gonna buy anything from their Check out our patri on and check out the different tiers and the exclusive content. You can get shudder. Use HMT at checkout to gets 30 a free trial. Thank you so much to all our listeners and for the feedback, even the negative feedback. We We love it. And it’s important to us to get here. We want to be better. We truly do. We We don’t want to be too salty, and we do want to change for the better. So continue reaching out to us. And thank you so much to our special guest, Aaron Hansen, for coming in and giving a unique perspective on the Shining and teaching us a little knowledge about music history as well. Hearing thank you on that is for movie talk, but by a place out place out with that horror porn. Oh, uh, soundtrack by horror Porn? Yeah.

I don’t
want to go too far into detail in the spoilers section for Doctor Sleep because
I don’t want to do a disservice to the craft of film making that this movie
features. Instead I’ll break it down into what I liked and didn’t like about
the movie. Be forewarned, this is still spoilers!

The Callbacks to The Shining

There were so many visual callbacks to The Shining
hidden in plain sight in Doctor Sleep that I couldn’t keep them all
straight. The movie starts with a flying shot similar to the iconic opening
shot of The Shining and it also recreates that same opening shot as they
approach the Overlook Hotel at the end of Doctor Sleep.

Dr. John Dalton, the man who employed Danny when he got sober,
has an office that looks exactly like Ullman’s office in The Shining.

Danny Lloyd, the kid who played the original Danny, has a
cameo during the baseball scene.

The first hospital room that Danny walks into when he finds
his gift of sending dying people off into death is 217. Room 217 is the room
that Timberline Lodge (the location used for panoramic shots of the Overlook
Hotel) changed to 237 for the original movie.

All of these and so much more. They recreated so many scenes
and so many sets from The Shining, and it all plays so well. I really
had a lot of nostalgia while watching Doctor Sleep, and it wasn’t the
cheap, easy to create kind – it was the earned kind.

The True Knot is Seriously Messed Up

As far as bad guys go, The True Knot is unassuming and
impressive. They look like normal people and act a bit like gypsies, traveling
around the country in a caravan of motorhomes and trucks, looking for their
next meal.

When we learn what The True Knot does to get their next
meal, my stomach turned. They find little kids who have the shining, and they
brutally torture them with the intent of causing as much pain and suffering as
possible. Pain and suffering in those with the shining causes the release of “steam,”
which is what The True Knot feeds on. Finally, they kill these children and eat
up what’s left of the steam.

There is a scene where they kidnap a small boy and torture
him, and it was almost unbearable for me to watch.

The Shining as a Super Power

It was hard to tell exactly what “the shining” was in the
original movie. I could tell that there was something about Danny, but it wasn’t
fully fleshed out, and it left quite a bit to the imagination. Doctor Sleep doesn’t
smack you in the face with a heavy handed description of what the shining is,
but it does show you that there are a lot of different flavors of it. It also has
enough characters with the shining for you to begin to realize that it’s
basically a superpower.

People with an affinity for flowers. People who can make
others do whatever they say. People who can read the future. People who can see
ghosts. You get it. Just like superheroes, each person shines at different
brightnesses. Some have more power, some have less.

At no point was it ever said that this was a superpower
movie. It just is. That’s confidence in the product on the part of the studio
and the creators, and I like it.

The Sound

There is a deep, bassy heartbeat and some pretty great
string music throughout that seems to cover 85% of this movie, and it kept me
wrapped up in the cocoon of this story quite nicely.

The Casting

Goddamn! I do mean, WOW! Everyone is so well cast that this
movie had no choice but to be great. Ewin McGregor has hints of Jack Nicolson
in his face. All the actors they cast to re-shoot the scenes from The
Shining were dead-on both in looks and in mannerisms – it was great.

The Story

I feel like it’s been forever since I saw a story on the big
screen that was new (to me) and was also well done. Doctor Sleep kept me
enthralled from beginning to end, and I love it for that. I would even go to
see this a second time, which almost never happens.

Farts

This movie features a lot of farts. early and often. I really felt for poor Winslow, since I can empathize sitting across from a flatulator in a confined space.

There are a lot of confusing elements in this film by design. It’s hard to say whether some elements of the story are spoilers or not, given they are so open to interpretation.

Naked Lighthouse Keeping

One element of the story is that Winslow is very interested in usurping Wake in the coveted night watch in the lens room.

Winslow peeps on Wake at different times throughout the movie. Early on he sees Wake naked and drunk at the top of the tower. Wake is seemingly in love, or at the very least, enchanted with the lighthouse light.

Later Winslow is able to catch glimpses of Wake in the tower possibly having sex with a tentacled monster.

Bad Luck to Kill a Seabird

When Winslow complains about a meddling seagull, Wake informs him that “It’s bad luck to kill a seabird”.

Winslow doesn’t take Wake’s advice and is later shown violently killing the one-eyed seagull that keeps seemingly mocking him.

After the death of the bird, things do not go well for the pair. The wind changes and the boat that was supposed to relieve them couldn’t make landfall because of the poor weather. Winslow slowly goes crazy and the lighthouse itself starts coming apart at the seams.

One interpretation is that Winslow brought a curse upon himself by killing the seagull. However, it is just as likely that his hallucinations and violence are caused by his alcoholism. The change in their fates also coincided with Winslow starting to drink (immediately to excess).

It’s up for the audience to decide.

The Ending of The Lighthouse Explained

Winslow reveals to Wake that his real name is also Thomas and that he is responsible for the death of a lumberman that he used to work with. Winslow’s murderous side is revealed at the end of the movie when he violently attacks Wake and buries him alive.

He finally ascends the lighthouse tower to see what all the fuss is about. When we looks into the light, he is blinded and falls to his death on the rocks below. The final shot of the movie shows Winslow on the rocks with his entrails being eaten by seagulls.

Eggers has stated in interviews that the death was an allusion to the myth of Prometheus, the god that defied the other gods to give men light, and was condemned to live eternity tied to a rock and have an eagle eat his liver everyday.

This episode Brought to you by Crazy Tom’s Beard Oil. With so many trendy hipsters with beards, it’s getting harder and harder for a hobo like yourself to show people that you’re not to be fucked with. Well, with crazy Thomas Beard Oil you can keep. Your beard is disheveled as 17th century sailors taint. When people see your beard with crazy times beard oil, they’ll cross to the other side of the street before they can even hear you talk about the voices. That’s crazy. Tom’s beard Oil available wherever. Two. Buck, Chuck Isolde Hello and welcome to horror movie talk and opinionated and accidentally funny horror movie review Show your panel of experts. Hosts each week are Dr Bryce Hanson, who holds a phD in spookology, and Professor David Day, the foremost expert on scare No-nos. New theatrical releases get priority, but we also review older horror movies both good and horrible. I’m break dancing. Hey, I’m David. Who are you going? Okay, David Day, David Day. Not to be mistaken for, um, little play or big say more David Gay Professor David D ad junk. I should say adjunct Professor David Day because you work professionally outside of the university. In scare. No nose, right? Yeah, I have. I’d like to, um I’d like to showcase a little bit of my super sexy voice. All right, this is for uncomfortable. So thank you for listening into horror movie talk. If your first time listener just want to tell you a couple things to get you integrated into the cult of Holder movie talk, go to our website at horror movie talk dot com. There’s three words in there that are very easy to remember because you like horror movies and we’re talking about him and there you’ll find links to all our social media were on pretty much everything. I mean, we’re even on tic tac, and we have no business being on tic tac. No, I mean well, as voyeurs. I mean, uh, God damn look at those hot children that would really prefer what What I’ve learned from tic tac. What I’ve learned, what that social media is mainly for is for theater kids that are underage, marching in place. That’s accurate. That’s sorry. A very attractive underage theater. Kids marching in place. That’s like 90% of tic tac, right? But I mean, you’re like, you’re like some some kind of like golden God, if you’re, like, older than 28 also very attractive. Yeah, it’s like a mim to be even in your 30. If you’re in your thirties on tic tac, they’ll call you a boomer. Yeah, it’s just anyway, so I check off the rails. Um, God damn, it’s hot, children. We post it every post every Wednesday, um, in the morning. So subscribe to the podcast if you like what you hear and also whether you like it or not, please leave us our rating on iTunes if you use an iPhone, and if you have any friends or relatives or stranger on the street, that has left their phone unattended, open up their apple podcasts and leave us a star rating because you don’t even have to write a review. Just star rating is not what we want. Price. I’ve been thinking about it. We really need to start appealing to listeners who run a back alley phone Resale racket. Yes, like like a like a pick pocketing racket. So, like, you know, like around the Eiffel Tower, there’s just people who just going to swipe your phone constantly. If we could get in touch with those people and just maybe sort of set up some sort of, uh, some sort of amicable thing that they give us reviews and we give them shekels. What are they looking for? Yeah, Frank’s little miniature Eiffel Towers T cell. All right, I know this madness. We’ve got a great show today. This is what happens when two men are left alone in a room for too long together. Yes. Today we’re gonna be talking about the lighthouse. We’ll start out by giving a brief review and our score for the film. We score on a scale of 1 to 10 1 being a miserable dredge when it makes you angry that you just watched it. Five being a perfectly average film that hits all the expected marks on 10. Being so good at transcends yonder bandage. I mean, you all know what one through 10 mean. After we give our score, we go into a deeper dive into what we liked and hated about the film and talk about spoilers. And then, later on, we will be doing a couple bits. Number one perennial favorite tag lines where we come up with alternate taglines for the film and then drum roll. We’re gonna announce the winner of our pumpkin carving contests are super super popular pumpkin carving. Actually, it turned out to be like there was a lot of last minute under the wire submission. Yeah, it was like the last day people were like, Fuck this shit I’m in, like, yeah, yeah, and actually, I’m gonna I’m leaving this leaving it on. I haven’t turned it up. So if within the next 20 minutes, as we’re recording not that everyone knows that we are, if someone submits, will will include them. And, I mean, it’s not so popular that we can’t review Every single pumpkin was on air, was it? Was it like, 10 or 11 pumpkin. Some, like there was 99 pumpkin, nine pumpkins. But some really impressive. Yeah. They range the gamut from total absolute abject shit to the most amazing pumpkins I’ve ever seen. So within nine is apparently that’s That’s the amount you need right to. That is a decent sample size to get a winner, right? So again, we went to the lighthouse and it was a descent into madness. Truly a descent into madness. Here is the trailer. Oh, take me. What’s a timber man want with being a wicky? Just looking around living. It’s like any man starting new on the way secrets, you know? Wait, How long have we been on this rock point? Weeks. Two days? Let me recollect. Man, That foghorn sounds like a kaiju. What, like a Godzilla type monster? Oh, yeah, it sure does. Yeah. You know, just before we go on, I am gonna have to apologize for my voice. I, uh I’m ill now. It sounds great. Sounds rough. And Hey, baby, humble rough and or tumble. Tell us about the lighthouse price. The lighthouse is in theaters right now. I’m pretty excited to talk about this movie. Yeah, this this one is a very interesting movie to talk about. Yeah, um it’s very specifically that Yeah, like that’s what this movie was made for. It is definitely a film student film. Yeah, and I mean film student in that film, students for a long time, we’re gonna be talking about this film. Oh, my God. There’s just me so many wet panties in that. So, in a sophomore film, Robert Eggers follows up The Witch with a romcom sent in Nova Scotia. William Dafoe plays an experienced sailor, and Robert Pattinson plays his young, simple protege in this Will they won’t they? Romantic drama. They fight happiness every step of the way until it finally wears them down. Finally wears them down. I spat out my teeth. Actually, the lighthouse is about to lighthouse keepers or weak ese that are stationed in remote Lighthouse. In New England, Willem Dafoe plays Thomas Wake, an elderly, salty seamen. And Robert Pattinson plays E from Winslow, a young man trying out a new career as Wake Domine ears over Winslow, forcing him to do all the hard labour of upkeep for the tattered lighthouse. He spends the coveted watch at night, basking naked in the warm glow of the lamp. Literal, yeah, basking naked. Yeah, that’s don’t worry about it. Winslow wants some of that sweet, naked, basking action, and he slowly descent into madness. So I’m glad you had fun with this. If you’re going into this film expecting another the witch, you’re going to be disappointed, Um, but disappointed that it’s not the same type of film and the witch it’s you know you won’t necessarily be disappointed in the film. No, but ifit’s a particular type of film, and it’s gonna turn off a lot of people for a lot of reasons. Yeah, for a lot of reasons in, You know, I said to you yesterday, and this holds true is you gotta like before we record You just gotta, like, scream and lose your voice because you sound just really radio right now. Beautiful. Yeah. Um, So I was disappointed that this movie wasn’t what I wanted it to be, which was another like, slow build tension horror movie. It’s not that it’s not, Ah, horror movie, and it just have slow build. Tension does have a lot attention, but it’s a different kind, right? And it’s about a different, totally different. The the build is into madness instead of into terror, right, which is a a terror in and of itself a little bit, but it is kind of specific, right, and it’s a great movie. It’s just not the same movie at all, right. This is a much more surreal and confusing film than the which, however, what this movie does share with Eggers, his first film is a meticulous, historically accurate film with a unique and striking visual style. Yeah, well, while I might not have loved this film as much as I thought I would I can’t help but have respect for Eggers is ambitious artistic vision. Um And then the other main thing is Pattinson and foe are amazing. I can’t I cannot I cannot believe how good patents in this. Yeah, they was. First of all, it’s perfect casting for both of them. Yeah, absolutely different. Defoe is obviously, like, so perfect for at this point, he’s like a perfectly ripe fruit. He’s just got he just got it down for acting. Yeah, but Pattinson blew me away. Like I was like, Oh, the guy from fucking twilight. Okay. Yeah, all right. But in particular I mean, William Dafoe. Willem Dafoe is a fantastic actor, and he couldn’t be great in anything but in particular this type of role. Oh, yeah, he is so good at I believe he’s that guy. Um they both give amazing performances. There are some really great scenes and monologues in here. General audiences are probably going to be turned off by a lot of the choices that are made in terms of narrated in terms of narrative and visual style. But film students will be creaming over this movie for years to come. I mean, it is just fascinating. And I mean, that’s what the takeaway from listening to our e aster and Robert Eggers in that a 24 podcast. The episode. They’re both huge film nerds like You just really like deep dives into history of filmmaking and, you know, lenses, 100 Eggers shots and stuff. So it comes out in this movie you can really tell in this movie. Well, almost to the point where it’s a little bit like yeah, okay, guy looking to shoot in 11 like, Yeah, I mean, it’s It’s a little that’s a little so that shooting in a 11 ratio makes it almost like on the surface. Do she? Yeah. I mean, it’s it would be very easy, And I’m sure there’s gonna be plenty of people in our horror or just General Egg. And general audiences are gonna look at this and be like, Well, this guy’s a huge, pretentious douche, right? Like this is just but also it is insulting to my sensibility. If he is that he’s way better at it than anybody else. Oh, yeah? Yeah, you know, kind of Shut up. Yes. I mean, it’s still a great movie. Is this a horror movie? Kind of. It has enough horror elements to qualify. Um, it’s way more of a horror movie than Happy Death Day to you. Oh, my God. Ah, But most of the focus is on the tension between the two main characters and the mental instability caused by seclusion and alcoholism. That being said, there are definitely some Lovecraft ian and folkloric or elements in here. So I kind of struggled with a score for this because I can recognize that it is a great, great film, but also, it’s not completely for me, right? I was There was some really great moments that I really enjoyed, but I don’t know if I’m going to be revisiting this film very much. And I know I laughed several parts and wince like it was very effective. Oh, yeah, and really beautiful. Um, but I can’t give it a 10 out of 10 like I did the witch e. I think the which is just a perfect movie. And this one I don’t know. I mean, it’s It’s just It’s so subjective. It’s a preference thing, but I give it a eight out of 10. Yeah, so I, too, have been thinking about this score. Excuse me for a while now, and Ah, and I seem to be hovering around a 72 and nine. And I know what you’re talking about. Like with the witch. Um, there’s nothing. There’s no fat on the bone. It all it’s all it’s all very wait well laid out. It’s all very intentional. But the problem is, the subject matter of this is losing your mind and so happy. And so there is a lot of nefarious, weird, extraneous baloney, right? That adds to that in ways that well, that could’ve been cut out. But could it right? Like Okay, well, now I get to see Willem Defoe kind of humping his bed in a in a in a in a take. This isn’t the spoiler section sleeping in a peeping tom sort of way. Is that necessary? Well, no. But also yes, because like, this is about two men going mad together, right? And ah, and so I think I think in If you ask me in eight months the same way. If you ask me in eight months about the house that Jack built, I think I’ll like this movie a lot more. Yeah, yeah, and it’s a good point in so because Because my expectations will have been tempered and I won’t I won’t expect another which I will have gone. Oh, that’s a movie about losing your mind. And it’s perfect at that. Yeah, and so I don’t know. I think I think I fall between eight and nine. Something like that. I’m not crazy ecstatic about it. Yeah, and that’s a taste thing, But it’s a It’s a great movie, so you gotta choose. Is it eight or nine? That’s I mean right now as as it as it stands, I’d say it’s a high eight. Okay, Yeah, see? I mean, I originally was going to give it a seven, and then I stood back and I was like Huh, It’s too good to be a seven iss. It really is that the quality of the of the craft is so impressive. Acting alone makes is so is so great yet that it has for me, it’s just Oh my God like it was so, so brilliant watching the chemistry between the phone patents and like, yeah, I mean, it’s enchanting. Yeah, it was. It was it. And it’ll stick with you in a weird sort of salty breeze kind of way. Yeah, so that’s our score. Before we get into spoilers, let’s talk about some business items. This is what we call our mid roll section. Please check out our patri on if your ah, long time listener or if you’re starting to get into the show and like it, support us directly by going to our patron, you’ll get access to special patron bonus content. 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Yeah, so yeah, again. Thanks for listening. Let’s get into school. Boilers, boilers, Spoilers. Okay, so this is a movie that you don’t necessarily have to talk about all the beats of it of the film because I still don’t really know what went on through a lot of it. There’s a couple things to hit in terms of plot, but really, I wanted to talk about it’s some of the It would be annoying in the extreme to hit it be by being Yeah, so just want to talk about some of the elements that stood out and that were really great and unique about this film. Um, first of all, the visual style is really striking right off the bat. It’s you really hard if they start out on a ship in the fog. And it’s just this gray screen with this haunting like you like he said, Like Kaiju esque, um moaning, foghorn in the distance. That’s just that kind of shakes the whole theater. Yeah, well, that would be sound. Um, but we’re talking about visual style. Oh, my apologies. Sorry. Put you on blast. So first thing that you notice is ah, the aspect ratio is 1.19 by one, which is basically square. Yeah, it looks like an instagram frame. And it’s one of those things that and it’s in black and white. So black and white square aspect ratio And even I knowing Eggers and that this is gonna be a super artistic film. And I think I even heard that the aspect ratio was gonna be that. But even I was expecting after the intro to be like and now it widens out in tow. Widescreen. It’s like, No, no, you The full time is that aspect ratio super confined and claustrophobic, which actually works really good for the subject matter. Yeah, and the and there are not a lot of any time you’re with a person in this movie, you’re close to them. It the framing is Cloris. It’s lots of close ups. Yeah, and I mean putting it in that aspect ratio is really interesting in terms of the balance of the conflict, the framing of it, of the shots. I don’t know, it’s it just has a really unique style is really evocative, Um, showing stuff in such unequal framing. You know that the one thing that does bother me about like Ma modern movie trends is this is and it’s inescapable at this point, it seems like because even the lighthouse is doing it, which is these cut These jump cut edits where you just cut back and forth between two people talking instead of having a full frame of them talking. And I understand the reasoning behind it in this moving. But in movies like Transformers or something like that, work just any blockbuster movie where you constantly have to be looking directly at the face of the person who is talking to the other person, who then it jumps to and it it cuts up the movie in this weird, like if you go back and watch Hitchcock or if you go back and watch movies from from the forties or fifties that you get these long panning shots that are that are granted, they’re probably much, much harder to capture in terms of acting, because you can just have a take. You have to have people act against each other very, very in a very convincing way, and it doesn’t lend itself to the cutting room floor very well. But I would like to see a movie that doesn’t that has these long panning shots. Yeah, it feels like older movies definitely used the two and three shot a lot more and put put people in the you know, what would he call that? They stage it a lot better toe, but it’s also the films of those older generations are also much more closely related to stage, and so they’re used to blocking for Stage two, where you know people are frame to sir, they’re they’re facing a certain way. It’s where it’s all very convenient to see him at the same spot, right, But it’s But for the viewer, it’s a continuity thing. It’s a little bit disorienting. It’s I didn’t notice that in this in this movie I mean, there’s a lot of jump cuts and stuff that that air a little giant on purpose. But I didn’t know specifically that, Um, I mean, it’s something that I watch for just because my uncle well will literally not watch anything past a certain year because he’s like It’s too. He noted that he said, he’s basically it’s just just too jarring for me and I don’t I don’t appreciate the craft as much as I do. And so now I have an eye out for it. And, ah, that’s interesting. And he’s right, you know it is. It is choppy. But anyway, so the look of this film is also affected by the technology used. They used some really, really old technology. Older lenses, older cameras really film, nerdy stuff, older film stock. The film stock was I’m not a nerd enough to actually say what the film they used was. But what I did find out about it is that it requires really high exposure, like you have to have said something like they had the light it like 20 times brighter than normal. Thio, get stuff visual, you know. So apparently, even though this film feels really dark, really 10 through a lot of it, apparently, like the thing the Via Crew would have to wear like sunglasses a lot of the time because it was so brightly lit. That’s crazy. Um, and this all gives the effect that this film is plucked out of time. Yeah, it’s there’s a shot early on of Dafoe and patents and basically looking in the frame as they’re approaching the lighthouse or their know they’re looking at the at the boat sail away beginning and it literally looks like an old West photo or like a World war documentary shot, just like Okay, guys, stand here. I just wanna I just want to get a shot of E. And it looks like two grizzled war veterans that are like, what? I got to stand here and do this shit money I got. I gotta feed them hogs, you know, like it’s the so I mean, there’s a lot of that element that all this visual style really evokes. Yeah, and as in right following that as the boat as they’re watching the boat slip away into the fog. It feels like a miniature Feels like they’re using a miniature boat. Then they Maybe because it slips off into like this What feels like a miniature set? Yeah, and missed. It kind of just disappears into the mist. Um, okay, let’s Now, let’s talk about the sound design of the movie, which is also fantastic. Um, like you said, What were you gonna say about the foghorn? Oh, it was just It was rattling. And it was, you know, it was, um Yeah. Okay, so if you’re going to if you’re going to live on top of the foghorn and there’s fog around, it’s going to be pervasive to the extreme. I mean, the sound is just going to be all encompassing. And it felt that way in the theater. It felt it felt like, uh, oppressive. It was this, um Oh, it was like a war siren and it Ah, it was loud and deep and long and it didn’t stop. It felt it felt a little Tetsuo the Iron Man e at the start of this movie, when he’s like in the, uh, in the coal room, you know? Yeah. And the result this machinery around him. It felt very claustrophobic and loud. Yeah, so the that sound. They used recordings of period accurate foghorns. Apparently, the sound designer on this film went to this guy on YouTube that makes YouTube videos, of course, maintaining foghorn landlord about period foghorns. I think I’ve actually seen some of the videos which are really soothing, like it just shows him, like oiling and maintaining these old foghorns, and you see it winding up and slowly, like the machinery’s like taking away, and then it slowly winds up. Ah, you know, it’s really cool anyway, So they took the, like, the period accurate foghorn sounds, and they manipulated them to be more ominous, memorable and unique to the film. It really is a unique sound and very like menacing. Yeah, and the in the sound of the ocean. And the weather is always in the background and always, always kind of washing over you and the music is there, but it’s pretty sparse. It doesn’t get in the way. Um, Eggers talked about just what he wanted with the film. He didn’t want a lot of strings. He didn’t want a lot of, um, you know, orchestrations a lot of wins, Um, mentioned like Alia torque music, which is kind of random chance music chanting No chance. What’s chance? Like roll of the dice Chance I don’t I still don’t know what you’re talking about. Probability. Oh, chance. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Um, So I thought you were saying C h a N t s. And like explaining that dice were an instrument. Bryce, are you insane? The production design? Same. Same with, uh, his previous movie, the which is really impressive. Yeah, just period accurate. They look fantastic. They built an actual life sized working lighthouse from scratch in Nova Scotia. Are you serious? Yeah. So they didn’t They didn’t build all the interiors and stuff, but the the exterior, it was all built up life size, but it is working because they had a period appropriate lighthouse lens created for the film. It’s like, Wow, that’s really cool. And when Robert Eggers talks about the budget is like, yeah, I mean, it was kind of a moderate budget, but I can’t even sometimes I’m I just have to stand back and realize and filmmaking. It’s really expensive. Can you imagine just going to a period lighthouse Lens creator being like, this is the specific dimensions and this is what we’re going for. And they’re like, OK, yeah, well, well, that guy goes home to his wife and he’s like, So well, Ah, film studio approached me and asked me to craft them 1\/2 $1,000,000 light house deal. So, yeah, they really built it. You know, it’s built out of, like, plywood and and apparently, like some kind of printed tarp or whatever, but it looked great. Apparently, the the town in Nova Scotia that could see the lighthouse really wanted to keep it because it looked so cool. But it was gonna fall apart anyway, so they had to tear it down. That’s crazy. Yeah, And then they’re the interiors, though, were shot on a soundstage. A lot of the weather was just practical, like, I mean, not not practical. It was like, literally, that was the weather that was there. I think some of the more extreme ones, like when the wind and rain blows through the wall, you know? Yeah, like, basically destroys the room. That’s probably done on a sound stage. But the exteriors, I don’t think they had to pump in rain. That was really happening. The ocean. I’m sure they were able to shoot the ocean. I was a harsh mistress. Eso it just looks really great. Feel there’s a lot of care and attention given to the look of this film and also speaking of period, appropriate all the dialogue, just like the which was taken from period sources taken from Melville. And it was the other author, another like sailor author and then, like a, I think a nonfiction er or someone like taking interviews from sailors back then and so there’s a lot of words that you’re not used to like Wiki. It would. It would definitely help. Um, this movie, I think, if particularly if Dafoe was subtitled, yeah, because he I mean, he goes hard on on being like, Accurate and e. I mean, he accomplishes like, you know, that old Irishman sound where you’re just like, What the fuck did you say is I like you brought from front and he’s like, is like, It’s like, God damn, I can’t understand a fucking word that you’re saying for a friend. Yeah. I mean, it’s not so bad that you won’t completely understand them and a lot of that old sailor talk like you’ve seen from, you know, parodies of sailors from from that time. Um, but definitely a lot of words that you’re not used to, and a lot of phrases that feel very, you know, real to the time period. So the acting is the standout part. I mean, that’s That’s the one thing like the look and the production and the sound are all amazing. But all of that is completely eclipsed by the performances of the phone. Pattinson. Yeah, it’s and Defoe has I mean he Okay, so obviously the foe is one of those guys who every time you see Amigo, that’s Willem Dafoe. At this point, I kind of like Steve Buscemi or his voice is really distinctive. And his voice is really he’s got. He’s able to have a lot of different colors in his voice, but definitely like the low growl is like his. His a wheelhouse. Yeah, and and so with that being said, it’s as a super recognizable actor I am that makes your job a lot harder, in my opinion, because now you gotta fade into into your character and it’s it’s all it’s made all the more difficult by the fact that everybody knows what you look and sound like. And they go, that’s who you are. But But he did it, man. He disappeared into this role. He is in this. He’s a stinky old, salty bastard who is just ah, his only love is the sea. And, um, man, just a just a fabulous performance. Yeah, I mean, he’s fantastic. And you would expect, like, Okay, this is perfect for Willem Dafoe, and he’s gonna just rocket. And then you kind of expect Lee. I mean, I haven’t seen Robert patents, and I’m a lot of movies. No, I know he’s a better actor than to The Twilight Series would give you the impression, but he was really amazing. Crushed it like, really, he is the He is leading the movie with his performance, a lot of rain. She’s starts out. The film is a really quiet spoken character and really elicits a lot of empathy from the viewer. You’re like, Oh, man, this poor guy like it’s has to deal with this old crusty sailor and it’s kind of unjust, and you’re really, like getting behind him like, yeah, I’m like I’m on board with with, um What’s his name? Uh, went Winslow Elias. Elijah? No. Uh, l l m Allen from e from Winslow, Calum. And ah. And then he just slowly kind of kind of loses you devolves into evolves into, like, to where it’s like, Well, wait a minute. He’s kind of He’s kind of being selfish here is kind of being childish about this. Maybe is not as mature. Yeah, he’s a person now and then. And then it goes into like, Oh, well, that’s Oh, this this guy is making some real bad choices. Yeah, and, ah, it goes real hard into the paint. Yeah, he devolves into a flawed person instead of, you know, basically a ah ah, beating a whipping boy Lots of moments in between. Between ah, being a really empathetic character and and protagonist to like, Oh, this guy’s the villain. Kind of Yeah, yeah, but is he like that’s that’s That’s the coolest part of this movie, is is the movie is essentially gas lighting the audience right? Um, the whole time and I love it. I love that. If it does it, it manages to to mess with you the whole way through and make you question everything that’s going on. Yeah, and it’s not. See, it’s not as obvious as a movie like Memento or right or ah, what’s the other one? That this movie is a lot like What’s that? Leo DiCaprio, Martin Scorsese Island Shutter Island? Um, like they’re more obvious ways to, like right to trick the viewer and to show like, Hey, this isn’t what you thought it was right? And this is much more plane with colors like that that that was one thing that I wrote down that even those is a black and white film. This is a very it deals with colors in terms of thematic material and just the the subject matter and how it’s house approached. It’s like a lot of different. Well, it does. It does what I prefer a movie like this does instead of instead of Okay. So it was a great example that you bring up Memento or Shutter Island. So these these movies have truths at the end of them, right? They have absolute truths that they go. No, here’s the answer here. Here’s what actually is really going on, and this movie does not do that, it leaves it fairly. La Billy. It’s like I Which part of that was actually which part of that was actually riel? There are parts that you can pretty easily deduce. That’s probably was him going mad. But there’s plenty of spots where it’s like I don’t I don’t I still don’t know, like, and he leaves it to you to just be like, This is madness, man. Yeah, you’re going. You’re descending with them. It really feels. Feels like an experience. Yeah, days. So the the uncertainty brought in is okay. How much of this is alcoholism vs insanity or what’s the interplay between that? How much of the events are actually supernatural vs, like, hallucinations and madness? Yeah, like that’s names Li like, how much of it is a dream? Yeah, And how much of it is? Is Winslow going mad versus wake fucking with him, right? Like it’s all and you’re never liked all that stuff you’re never given. Never get really straight answer. And like the whole time is it seems as though Wake is a puppeteer and is and is trying to drive this this boy mad. But he’s pretty crazy. Yeah, it comes down to its an unreliable narrator is It’s very much like American Psycho is that you don’t It’s never tipped off whether it’s really eso eso the stuff that happens where Wake says something that completely contradicts what you just saw. Just out with your eyes. And he’s saying, Like So for example, there’s a great scene. Very Ah, the shining esque Uh, you know, actually, this movie, uh, I didn’t write it down, but this movie is a lot like the shining. Yeah, you’re absolutely right. The the actual like book storyline of it cause the Shining is all about alcoholism. Yeah, like the actual source material. And that’s not as clear in the Kubrick movie to me upon first viewing, but it’s really about isolation and alcoholism. And that’s this movie. Yeah, it’s absolutely and ah, so it has this great scene where we see Pattinson chasing after Defoe. No, we see Defoe chasing after Pattinson with an axe like a literal axe murderer in Chase, and they get back to the interior of the lighthouse and they’re talking about it and then wake our Defoe tells Pattinson, was like, you’re going crazy. You just chase me down with an axe. Yeah, and you’re like, Well, wait, the flat the fuck. So So you have your left a question? Did what I see is that not what actually happened was that in Winslow’s head four is wake fucking with Winslow by telling them something opposite happened. And since he’s drunk, he can’t tell the difference. There’s an added element of of the audience being fucked with Yulia. Whoa! Very disorienting. Yeah, it’s disorienting in. You’re just just messing with your head because you go Wait, What? That’s no, wait. What rank and then is such an unreliable narrator because they’re both pretty drunk. I mean, Wake is less drunker towards the 2nd 3rd of the movie like so it’s It’s like, Ah, if it’s through the eyes of Winslow, it’s not reliable. But also if through the eyes awake, it’s not reliable either. You don’t know Wake is lying. Winslow is maybe going crazy. Yeah, Or maybe it is. Maybe he’s not lying for me. He’s not lying. Maybe Winslow is just misinterpreting it, or it’s through his crazy hallucination or something. So you have lots of uncertainty in this one. Um, we went and saw this with Kevin. Um, Kevin wasn’t able to make it to their recording today. I don’t know if he’ll ever be able to make it. I hope he does. Does the audience know who Kevin is? We’ve talked about Kevin once or twice before. Kevin is Ah, long time friend of mine since first grade. Yeah. Um, and he’s we nerd out about film all the time, But he sent me a couple e mails followed up with last night, and I wanted to read some of his comments. Um, first of all, he says on a theme, Hold that one for later. Hey, says, by the way, Thomas Wake is such a fucking fantastic name for an old salty lighthouse keeper, Which is true, Kevin really nerds out of names. And if you ever want to come up with a name for a character in a movie, Kevin, like, is great at coming up with the ridiculous names. Okay, Um, just f y i and he says and again Robert Pattinson. I don’t know if you’re planning on talking about this on the podcast, but I would personally dedicate a whole segment in it. The guy was so stiff in the Twilight Films that he resembled Frankenstein’s monster trying to portray Dracula and has been reeling off one amazing performance after another. As of late, I never saw it coming. Yeah, he’s really impressive in this. Yeah, it’s hard. Okay, so, like, this is such a weird thing. Like it’s so snobby to toe Look at an actor and okay, so my my reaction is there could be good good actors in in what I call Twilight, but there are. But also I don’t like. I particularly don’t like Kristen Stewart. Uh, I think she’s bad. And so I just now there’s this thing that my mind does where it’s like, Oh, you’re associated with Kristen Stewart. Sorry and and and Twilight is hit with, like a triple dose of that right. It’s also a twilight, and there’s Kristen Stewart, and you play it super stiff and your heartthrob like it’s just too much. It’s too much for you to be good in my eyes, and then you come out and you do like an amazing job, and I’m like you’ve overcome my bar when surpassed it. So much so that now I have to stand back and go boy. I’m kind of a dick. Yeah, and also, it turns it into Okay, well, now I got to see what else he’s in, right. Um, it’s interesting the transition of teenage heartthrobs, especially the male version of it, that they It’s hard for them to overcome that I’m sure it’s harder for for women to overcome that. But really, if you think about like Zac Effron or Robert Pattinson, they’re both actually really great actors, like they’re they’re able to give really great performances, but they have to overcome a lot of that like womb. And we’ll leave. Do I get to see his and and for good reason to Zac Effron is a fucking looker. You have a person. Why would I would fuck That is stunning to look at, right? It’s and I mean, there’s no way. If if I were to cash Zac Effron in a in 1\/17 century period piece, I’d have him take a shirt off at some point. Probably his pants, too, because Jesus, front on that on that note, like even Robert Pattinson to Robert Pattinson or, um uh, McConaughey like he’s he’s so yeah, he’s so like colored by his abs. Yeah, and not wearing a shirt that you don’t realize that he’s a fantastic actor. Yeah, all all of them Stunt, like in Pattinson in this lake. Thank God they had him take off his shirt because at some point he took off his shirt like Jesus Christ, that man is chiseled. Oh, man. Well, yeah. Apparently they’re gonna show a lot more of Robert Pence and Root. I heard that there was a shot in the film that was cut. Um was demanded to be cut by the film studio. I think Robert Eggers wanted to have a shot of the lighthouse, um, emulating an erect Penis and then flash cut to an actual erect Penis. Oh, um, owned by stunt Robert Robert Pattinson’s character. So I don’t I don’t know. If it were, that will bring out the stunt cock. I mean, that’s that’s a real tragedy. If it was actually Robert Pattinson’s Kaka that we that we aren’t allowed to see here. Well, that just means you gotta wait for the blue ray. Um hey, you know, ball Ray, I would really like to talk about the smell in this movie star. One of the parts. One of the main element to this movie is the farts. This is great. Um mm. Yeah. Willem Dafoe. Basically, our introduction to him as the characters is him. Pass, pass, pass, pass theme Really big rips it. Sze pervasive and it works Every time I laughed probably every time every day because it is just a old man type. I don’t give a fuck farting and you just see patents and reaction to it. And, you know, I really felt I felt very akin to to that man because it’s basically like what I experienced every day in a podcast. You recording? Yeah. Realizing you’re stuck with a fart er is a hard thing to come to turn through. It’s like, Oh, this guy just doesn’t do my wife my poor wife, like last night and the night before, even like Like, you take a walk out of out of our bedroom in the morning, you know, for five minutes and then come back in and it’s like, Oh, my God, I’m no longer Akeelah mated. 00 it smells so bad. She’s like you were just hot boxing me all nightly. I had some beers at the movie. It made me gassy. Um, yeah, yeah, it was It was gross, but But this dude stuck with a fart er for seven months or no, maybe a month. I think the original. The original stay for their watch was four weeks, it says. And then they said that was what I they missed the boat. And then it’s or the boat doesn’t come because of a storm. We don’t know. It’s undefined on how long this actually takes place, but they go through all of their supplies and they have toe unburied the the emergent emergency store rations, which is just alcohol, apparently like we don’t need like any pickled eggs or anything. Let’s just let’s just give them vodka like a giant box of vodka. Well, I mean it it is. It’s it’s truly is the most important part because when you don’t have potable water, you you need calories and you need you need to be able to drink insult that this is a really This is why sailors were drunk all the time is because they did. They could not store enough potable water and s o and they like to drink, So it worked out very well because one has calories. Yeah. So, um yeah, there’s so much to talk about in this movie. We way e beauty like so this movie like Okay, so they get to the lighthouse and and and quickly, it’s it’s the hierarchy is established. A foe is like, Hey, you’re the bitch. Go do the bitch things. I’m going to take the cool. I’m He’s like, I’m cool, man. Hot shit over here. And I’m going to do the cool man hot shit stuff, which is I’m a sin in the lighthouse at night. And look at the the lighthouse inside the with the with the light and ah, but then almost immediately, it’s like, Whoa, this is fucking weird because his first shift, he’s he gets drunk off his ass and he goes and sits up with the lighthouse, like in the light house naked. And I mean haggard, like, just blitzed out of his mind. One eye is almost close, and he’s sitting there just like cheers ing with the lighthouse as though it is a person that he is in love with very much right. And he’s like to ye e beauty and, uh like what the fuck is going on? Because he’s like touching himself. Kind of. Yeah, Robert Pattinson’s character climbs up the lighthouse to kind of see what’s going on. And Cem come comes down like some come drops past him is like, Whoa, yeah, come Well, there’s the 1st 1 It just looks like the first time you see the fellow up there. Um, he is naked and he is really drunk. And there’s something going on between him and the light, but you don’t know. And then later I think before, yes, before, um, the madness really starts or before, like the out before. Ah, before points starts, drinking starts drinking. Yeah, he goes up there and there’s like you can spot like a tentacle in the corner, something someone’s fucking similarly, some fast moving tentacles. And there’s like, Come or tentacle juice dripping down. And it’s like what is going on? So and again, this is before he started drinking. So is it in his mind? And this is really happening? This is what I love the most. This is my favorite move that a movie can do. It’s not like you don’t ever get to know it’s just What the fuck was that? I love it. Yeah. So the main point is, is Wenzel doesn’t drink, He wants to live by the books. And he’s like, citing the lighthouse Keeper’s Manual. And and wake is trying to get him to, you know, be a little looser and be more, you know, fun and talk to him. Yeah, I’m stuck here for a long time with you. Can you please hold up your end of this social bargain? Yeah. And it’s not until they missed the boat. Is that the last day? Um, there last night, patents and finally breaks down and takes a drink. And they get roaring drunk immediately, like they are just completely blasted. And then the next morning, when they go out and wait for the boat, the boat never comes. So from then on, though, like Winslow does not go back to sober living, he is 100% into the paint with drinking. Yeah, and there’s some there. Some Ah, Woody Woody call some symbolic imagery and some symbolic shit going on in this movie as well with seagulls and burger seabirds. Yeah, that’s don’t kill a sea bird. Yeah, I guess before that point, kind of the the main turning point of the movie. It’s a bold fucking Siegel that they have the hefty Siegel’s and 11 night Siegel, in particular kind of is really annoying and mocking Pattinson’s character and Thomas Wake Dafoe’s character makes it a big point. Two. Don’t fuck with Siegel’s, he says It’s bad luck to kill Seabird because there it’s even says in the trailer there. How’s the souls of sailors passed? And then, of course, what happens? He murders the fuck out of Siegel. He kills that thing shitless. Yeah, he really just grabbed that Siegel and rams it into the side of a rock like over and over and over and over again on. And that’s when the turning point is, that’s when the wind changes. And when they missed the boat and then all of a sudden it’s like a really deep dive into madness. And that’s when a lot of the kind of supernatural or horror elements kind of start coming in. Winslow spots a mermaid. Yeah, it kind of goes full Jumanji it. After that, it’s like it’s like just the place starts coming down around them because this storm just won’t let up, right? There’s some fucking There’s some animals coming out of the sea looking to fuck like it’s weird. You get a really good. I mean, we don’t get to see it Pattinson’s dick, but you get a really good shot of some mermaid puss. Yeah, it’s like a screen flash of like, the most vaginal thing I can think of which it was just a flash. Wasn’t like a long shot of a vagina. I can see it right now, but yeah, I can too. So they talked about how they came up with that. They based it on the shark vaginas. Apparently they tried to make a real, real vaginal home. Thio add that element of Yeah, it was a talking point of a flower, you know, it was like woo. Yeah, that’s the sound booth. They apparently historically, mermaids had split tails like on the Starbucks Cup. You know, because part of the big part of the reason for the mythology around mermaids is that you got horny semen and they want to fuck something like it would be easier if there’s, you know, setting something up there. Yeah, And then, of course, in the Victorian era, they put the tail back together where there’s no vagina. So you’re like, Well, why am I attracted to this? What? Well, I mean, I guess you know it Got handing them out Dolphins d stuff. Um, you know, uh, the horn in this is a big part of this movie. Oh, yeah. A big, huge part. Yeah. And it’s it’s almost analogue Ori of, like, situational homosexuality. Yes. Yeah. There’s a huge element of, like, just all of a sudden you’re like, are things going? But is that what’s gonna isn’t about to get his butt stinky in here? Yeah. And, ah, Like I said, it’s a joke. But really, there is an element of will. They won’t think in this movie. Yeah, absolutely. There is. And it’s understandable to you, like I mean, Okay, so ah, buddy of mine. One of our one of our patron members, Adrian was telling I was he was talking to him this week and he said, um, you know what are you reviewing its in the lighthouse? And he said, Oh, you know, So he just he just hiked a a trail, um called the Westcoast Trail and It’s in a Victoria Island, um, in British Columbia there and lots of lighthouses along the way. And ah, and lighthouses are still ah, thing you know, it’s not. It’s they’re not gone. There’s there are still people who inhabit them as well, and which is kind of crazy because everything’s got GPS. Now, why would you need a light to show you where the shortest? Well, because because not everything is a giant commercial vessel. And and, um And there is a service that the government needs to provide, too, to make sure that people are safe. And part of that is Coast Guard. On the other part is light houses. And and so these people who in hat he was telling me, these people who inhabit these lighthouses, you know, they could they go out there for seven month shifts, seven month shifts. Where there alone? Yeah, for seven months, they get, they get rat, you know, they get rations brought to them and books and stuff, but they’re essentially alone in a lighthouse in the middle of the ocean for a long time. And, uh and I think I would like, do something like that. Yeah, but I mean, if I didn’t have a family. Well, maybe because but but yeah, I mean, it’s It’s one of these things where it’s like, how How much would you say you masturbate in those seven months? Seven months worth of masturbation? Straight like a I don’t know. It’s just It’s one of those things where it’s like, Yeah, I mean, it would be on if there was another person there. Well, who knows? I mean, I mean, the rations would have to be all right. So we need, you know, three squares a day. We need probably like enough books to read one a day. And then you’d also need to, like, ship in an entire industrial barrel of lube. Yeah. And lotion and lotion. Just I mean, that salty sea air is not kind to your skin. No. Yeah. You’re going to get real chapped hands, and that’s not gonna be you’re gonna come out of there looking like a 75 year old man, and your dick’s gonna look like it’s 14. Yeah, you do, man, if you had, like, a one of those Ah, Woody column, Flashlight like the Yeah, flashlight. Like a pushy sleeve. That thing would just be sleep, just like melted. By the time you’re halfway through your stint, I need another pussy slave. Be ragged. Give me one of them. But sleeves, I’ll tell you what they need to make one of those mermaid pussy sleeves and then Okay, well, that’s a drop pussy. All right. And then, um, yeah, slow to send a madness. And then, you know, at this point, there’s not really a lot to talk about in terms of what happens. But the major spoiler is Doesn’t end up well, they both die. Um, I just wanted to touch briefly on my favorite scenes. Like, I think the best things in the movie if we haven’t talked about him already. Um, there’s a great scene where Winslow criticizes wakes lobster like it’s the breaking point. He’s like, You know what? Fuck you. Fuck you, old man. And you’re cooking sucks. And then and then Wake Dafoe’s character goes on this impressively long and elaborate ranting tirade. You know, just it felt like a Shakespearean lights. Feelings are hurt. He’s feeling to hurt. He’s like, don’t calling upon the powers of Poseidon and and don’t let me lob stirred her sing them and and like calling down the the supernatural elements of the sea to destroy Winslow for not liking this lobster on then at the end wins those like I like your lobster. All right. I like your laughter. It’s all right. That’s a fantastic scene. And I wish I could pull that for for this episode, but that’s that’s worth price of admission there. Um, the other main important scene is E from Oh, yeah, this important scene that David stepped out to pee. I turned to Kevin. Kevin has a notoriously small bladder moving like he is really like peeing all the time. I turn on said, I finally found someone that has a smaller bladder than you. That’s not fair, even remotely. I had a beer before I got there. 22 ounces, huh? And then I had 44 ounces before I before I went pee in the theater, huh? That’s 66 ounces. I mean, it’s not that you weren’t drinking anything. It’s not that I have a small bladder. It’s that I drink and you don’t. Yeah, but I feel like if you pee right before a movie, you could still hold it for two hours. 66 ounces. Yeah, but it’s not old leaking down there, though. I’ll tell you what, let’s have a contest. You and may well, go toe to toe water for water. All right. And, uh, we’ll see who lasts. All right. Anyways, David, step out at least three times from the theater. No, I stepped out to time. All right, Well, you think you know, actually, I didn’t I didn’t. I only stepped out the one time the first time I got up, walked over to the side and stood there and watched the movie. And then I was like, I can’t leave. And I sat back down. I never I never left the movie theater more than the one time when the only way from admitted well, he missed the most important thing in terms of the drama. So Hee from admits to murder. Um, back when he was a logger, he murdered a a coworker that annoyed him. And well, basically, the coworker felony did nothing to save him. And then he took on his name. So his name isn’t actually from wins. Oh, but is also Thomas Thomas, something I can’t remember and Ah, and that’s followed by one of the best lines that’s repeated over and over again. Why did you spill your beans? Why did you spill your beings? Why’d you tell me? And, ah, another great scene is is after Wake is well, actually, as weight has murdered, he’s being buried. So they fight and awake is basically like tattered. And, ah, he’s let out like a dog. See, this is weird where it’s like is this really happening? I was so surreal and weird. And so Defoe’s characters put in this pit and Pattinson is burying them and he’s like, Wake is talking to him and like having a monologue as he’s getting buried. It’s really striking and really cool scene. Um, that one will stick with me. Um, one of the most. This is like the scariest part of the film. For me, just from the visuals was really kind of frightening was when Winslow actually makes it up into the lighthouse and he looks into the light. I don’t know if you thought this was a school as I did, but I did It got super super overexposed. He was screaming, and it just looked like I mean it was could make really good creepypasta just the image of kind of burnt out black and the super like sound did it for me was it was it was like this again, like the sound was overexposed. And yes, it was like shrieking, super, super distorted. And it was what we call it’s not just over exposed. It’s like trying to think of what that setting would be. The contrast like Super super contrast. Yeah, it is what it is in black and white. So it looks really crazy. Yeah. And then Winslow um jumps out or falls out of the lighthouse, I guess onto the rocks. And the final like image of the film is Winslow on the rocks with his guts being eaten out by Bye Siegel’s Yeah, which is very, um, much a callback to the myth of Prometheus. So Prometheus is Ah, great God that gave fire to man gave fired a man against the gods wishes And then his punishment was He was lashed to a rock and his his innards were eaten by an eagle every day. Yes, that’s right. And he is immortal. He was supposed to push the rock up a hill every day. Know that, Cece Cece afis Now he was. He’s just chained to the side of a mountain, basically in a eagle, came and hate his guts neat every day, but he’d never die. So it’s not a good ending. Um, so, yeah, that’s the oh, there’s the other thing that Kevin said that I wanted to read thematically said another thing because we talked about generational stuff on the car ride home, you hike millennials versus boomers and all that stuff, he said, comes that. Actually, another thing I was gonna mention, but we moved away from it in the conversation. Forgot was when we got to the whole generation thing. The movie, the lighthouse, I thought kind of played on that theme with Wake and The Older Keeper with Wake is the older keeper of the Light and Winslow, the younger one, wanting to wrestle control away from Wake, that’s a good point and get the light for himself and all the stuff with Winslow finding Wakes log with all the criticisms reminding them of the generational lampooning that goes on. Yeah, and then there’s the obviously ah, lot of sea God mythology and stuff um it would be interesting. Something interesting to read into about what the characters were meant to represent. Ah, but yeah, the stuff around the Guardian and the younger seeker. So, uh, just the whole idea of the power interplay between the older and younger and and, Ah, yeah, that was kind of Ah, there might be some meta commentary in in this movie around Yeah, generations and how they view themselves. Yeah, you guys should Ah, if you’re not a patriot, remember, You guys should subscribe for the after pot, which is another podcast that we run for the Patriot members. And today I will be talking about a little bit about generation. Next in the author, Bret Easton Ellis in his book Less Than Zero and ah, kind of Generation X, The forgotten Jen. So So do that. Because it’s gonna be interesting, because it’s a It’s a fucking disturbing book. A super disturbing book. So if you guys want access to a whole nother podcast that we d’oh, check out our patri on me, I think it’s the $5 tear. Get you access to that check. So this this is a really great movie. Um, again not like on my top 10 or anything but super interesting of something that I’m going to think about for a long time. Um, who would you recommend to see this movie, or would you recommend people see this? Oh, yeah. Absolutely. I would, um, Look, if you appreciate, if you appreciate the craft, um or a Well, like a clearly well honed craft towards filmmaking, this is This is just You just can’t Can’t do much better than this. It would be criminal if this did not hit the award circuit given, given the award circuits love of this kind of stuff. Um, I would be very surprised if it didn’t You win a lot of awards, but but yeah, it’s gonna be a long year after years. Yeah. I mean, I also popular show I’m pretty pretty over the academy working, but all awards air kind of silly. And this will be a weird thing that both of them are lead actors. So I wonder it’ll be weird if one of them gets, um, supporting actor and one of them gets lead actor. Yeah, because they’re both like it’s so even. Yeah, um but I guess you could say Dafoe’s character is deck technically supporting actor. Yes. Um, and Befo already had got his. He got best best actor last year. Yeah, so I mean, there they deserve awards, if you care about that. Yeah, I’d also say this isn’t a movie for everyone, but it’s if you go see a you will definitely have not have seen anything like it before. Um, just as the finished product of the the visual style, the sound, the thematic material and the script writing and the acting is just just a really unique product. Yeah, and and all the commentary behind it. It’s all very interesting. It’s It reminds me of the house that Jack Belt or Suspiria in in terms of just in terms of care and craft An intent. All right, let’s move on to tag lines. Years, tagline taglines a game where we come up with alternate taglines for the movie we reviewed, um, that we think might fit better or what Not? How many do you have? I’ve got three or four. I’ve only got two. Okay, so you go first. I could probably do without one of them. Um, doing okay. I’m pretty happy with both of mine. Okay, So the lighthouse? Yeah, it’s pretty. That’s pretty. I was really wet. Yeah, well, that was the wet fart. Here’s the long one. Okay. The lighthouse. Oh, wait. The lighthouse. Ah, come on. I mean, this just must be a guy blowing arm. That doesn’t sound like for us that 1st 1 though. It’s pretty great. It was pretty wet. I definitely should have pants. 100%. The lighthouse. Oh, just kiss. Already there was one point where they almost did, too. Yeah, and then they were like, Hey, whoa, hey! Fucking got you trying to fuck it and fuck me, guy and maybe the lighthouse. 50. Fuck the lighthouse. 50 shades of beard. That was good. That’s good. The lighthouse. We’re all just one Siegel away from a very bad day. I have been moments where I’ve been, like, kill that fucking bird. Of course they’re my birds. So the lighthouse lighthouse More like fight house Shut the fuck This’ll was the best taglines ever, I think. Ok, one last one. And it doesn’t quite fit, but I still liked it. Light has more like fight the lighthouse, sir. I’m afraid you’ve gone mad with power. Of course I have. You ever tried going mad without power? It’s boring. No one listens to you. What’s that from? That’s from The Simpsons movie. Oh, okay. Um boo boo. You didn’t like the Simpsons movie? Oh, I thought it was pretty good. Ah, Spider pig got in mind. What? I’ve lost so much respect so much. You’re one of those guys. 01 of those guys were taste. Yeah, I am one of those guys. So let’s move on to our pumpkin carving contest. Yeah. So, uh, what’s the, uh So let’s make a sign for the BAP dap bap bap bap bap, bap bip Bip Bip pumpkin carving contest But But come on, get in on this bump on Papa Papa von Pumpkin Carving contest announcing the winners of a pumpkin car bank on. Ah, that’s the extent to which I’m marrying Thio. I You gotta commit David. All right, so if you didn’t know and some of you might not know we had a pumpkin carving contest and we’re giving away to the winner a set of hocus pocus funk Oh, pop dolls. Yeah. All three of the ladies from hocus pocus re re created for your viewing pleasure as fun co pop dolls, little bobblehead dolls. And then that’s the first prize. Second prize is we’re gifting the the track or the music of focus Hocus pocus by focus, focus pocus by focus, which, if you’ve never heard it. I mean, just go to YouTube right now and look that up. That’s delightful. Um, third prize, You get nothing. You don’t get any. So we’ve got, um we’ve been talking about it for about a month now. Probably not quite. Not quite a month, A couple, couple weeks, weeks tweeted about it. We’ve gotten a tweet. That was retweeted a lot. Yeah. How did you do that? That’s pretty good. I don’t know. I just just caught on fire. Just caught on fire. We’ve had actually more popular tweets than that one. Like a sense of how she can really take off pretty easily on Twitter. Yeah, it was our first experiment with a contest, and I don’t know what we’re doing wrong or like what the what the, uh I think that’s practices or more. Probably more time. Really? Yeah, I think we should We should have had at least one or two more weeks on there considering, you know, we we We’ve really only been talking about it for two or three weeks. Yeah, 10 10 entries is pretty good. Yeah. So we got nine entries and interest, and we can We can look at them all now and kind of comment it. We can tell you what they what they are. And then we’ll decide on air and of the wars. And, of course, if you want to check out the entries, they will be available on our Facebook and Twitter. And also, I’ll put all the pictures on the post for this episode as well. Can we put him on Instagram too? Maybe, uh, maybe cool, because our instagram it’s pretty dead. So what’s open? Take a look at some of these pumpkins, Punkin. Okay, well, so let’s leave big. And for the for the end. My body begging. Um, Okay, I got an entry from Steven R. Okay, let’s take a look at Stevens punk in here on this one. This one’s pretty good. This is as far as a straight ahead Jack o lantern. Pretty menacing grin, spiky teeth. Spooky eyes. Yeah, that was the eyes. Do a thing on this one where it’s like, kind of double its. I can’t tell if it’s the way that it’s not the way the pictures taken. It’s intentional that it’s like, super transposed thing. See how there’s like, two eye flutters at the tips of the Yeah, yeah, I mean, that’s carved. And then he’s got, like, kind of eyebrows carved into it and send it out. It’s pretty cool. Look, that is a really good entry. As far as like, a straight ahead Jacqueline. And I think that’s like a front runner. Yeah, for the Jack o lantern types, we’ve got Xavier de, which is a pretty awesome name. Or Xavier. If your friends Sure, um or X e x x avere We veer from the south, we have sufficiently destroyed your name. This one’s another Jack o’lantern Also very spooky. Yeah, I’d say on par with Stevens on forest, even like it’s ah. But he chose to light it with an l e d light. Did you just fart? What was that fart sound that you made? It was probably just from my throat. Yeah, I like. I like Xavier’s. It’s ah, it’s a meat and potatoes Jack o lantern like a pretty pretty strong on the needle teeth And another one from Magnus. We’ve talked about magnets before. He’s a good boy. Delight. See, Now, Magnus kind of went above and beyond here with the background. Yeah. Chose to say true amazing artist among the autumn leaves. So he’s got another jack o lantern. It’s kind of got a stitched mouth. Crazy kind of the nightmare before Christmas. Yeah. Eyes on it. Yeah, it kind of It’s kind of Jack, Jack O lantern or whatever is young is from this is this is really good. Um, I’m gonna the way all the way from sweetie. I’m gonna be honest. I’m kind of glad that Magnus isn’t the best one, because I didn’t really want to mail it to Sweet who? That would have been a spicy meatball. You know what I would have done as I would have just transferred funds for him to buy his own funk? Oh, pop. Like that way can’t. Magnus is great. He’s a super fan. He just threw a Halloween party and printed out a bunch of horror movie time. Yes, I’m I’m glad you brought this up. If you guys want to see pictures of Magnus is, um of Magnus is ah, Halloween party that he threw all the way over across the pond in Sweden. He threw a Halloween party at a like a bar or a club. That’s like it looks like it’s it looks like it’s underground, like in, like, you know, Europe. And, uh, it was attended by, like, 80 some odd people. Yeah, and it was a badass like themed zombie outbreak party. It was really cool. It was bad. So that’s so Pictures for that are on our last post, so that would be zombie land. Fittingly, Zombieland double taps. So check out his his party in zombie land. Double tap. Yeah, he’s a He’s a cool dude way, haven’t we? Haven’t checked. If we had a spike in Swedish listeners, we have It’s not. It’s not tremendous, but I mean I mean, I’m sure it’s Magnus driven. Yeah, thank you so much to listeners that recommend the podcast to friends, especially like this is a great time to do it. If you’re if you’re a little like shy about your fanaticism about horror movies, you don’t want to be that guy. Um, you know, people are watching horror movies around now, this is gonna be released on the 30th. So, I mean, you could share. Yeah. There’s a contact. Your friend? Yeah. There’s contact. Oh, now we’re getting into one of the one of the Oh, we’re not. Okay. Well, let’s skip over. Let’s go into the We’ll save the top three. And bottom one. Let’s check out Caitlin A’s. Caitlin, eh? Um, Caitlin and Garrett send in their jackal lanterns again. This is like a very straight ahead jackal entrance. Both of these. Yes, but they both have a little bit of attention to detail in the three d space. Like they Yeah, they think about the curvature of the pumpkin and kind of factor that into the whole thing, Which I appreciate. And I like Caitlin’s has, like, the mini pumpkin inside the maw of her Jack Atlanta tonight. I couldn’t I couldn’t see that. Hey, that’s pretty good. I like whenever they involved. Like, um extra, like little pumpkins, their stuff coming out of the mouth. So they’re a married couple. Is that other one next to her’s? Is that Garretts? Yeah. Okay. Okay. So, um oh, it’s not a pumpkin. It’s a Lauren. It’s a little orange with a sad face. Okay, so and then Garrett’s is similar. Similar standard. Um, what do you call it, Jack o lantern style. Um, you know, it’s menacing. It’s I think I like Caitlin’s more. Sorry if I’m assuming that the one with the orange is Caitlin’s. Okay, so now we’re getting into our top three thes air. The actual contenders like No offense the ones that we’ve talked about there they are great. No, none of them are embarrassing. I can’t wait until we talk about Big and sunk in just F y. I, like David has assured me that Begins is his game to be, like, made light of or like, you’ll never find a more amicable kind, like just jovial person than Brad, which I’m very glad because we’re just going to rip your apartment come from that bread. Uh, but let’s get into the top of the top three. Okay? Tina D. Submitted a great pumpkin, so it’s got the word creepy on it, and it’s dripping. It’s very like our, um, our logo. Almost. Actually, no. I think I know the font that she’s using. I think That’s a Google fund. This I might be wrong. This this. Okay, so Tina’s is such an expert skill level on carving. I can’t the Yeah, this is not like, um, there’s some some pumpkin carvings that air like they do kind of the shading effect by carving progressively deeper into it. This is a straight ahead all the way through the pumpkin, but it’s super skilled in that because it’s the lining is like she’s got that slightest little slivers of lines between the the the letters. Creepy. I cannot believe how how finally, detailed this thing is caught for straight carving. And then it’s got an eye above the word creepy with a little that that plays with, like, the negative space. The pupil is like a little bad guy, and he’s got a little hand. That’s part of the the eyelash. Yeah, it’s really good. I mean, the the font on is amazing. The drip effect is really cool. I mean, this is this is ah, definitely a front runner. Um, then we have Jared. Jared, um, it’s got Ah, let’s say Jared be okay. Um okay, this one I mean, this is to me, It’s it’s on another level, this is pretty impressive. So he’s got this. It’s almost unfair. E I mean, he’s got, like, the heck are those hexagons? I’m not beyond 123456 six sided. Ah, the thing is, what would that be? I don’t know. It’s not a Those are what bees make, right? Sure, honey, come, Ho would be a so hexes five. Okay, so cept her nose except a seven. We’re really again. We talk about formal, right, well researched on this on this pocket. Anyways, it’s got this geometric pattern and then the center it’s like and this is one of those pumpkins that that uses the depth of the pumpkin toe Let the light shine through. He never There’s a few spots where it’s just accented and actually carved all the way through. But most of most of this pumpkin is just is just surfaced carving yet in the center is an eye scooper detailed the I like very, very much like the black Christmas. I yeah, the crazy I you see through people and I want to point out this is fucking ridiculous. He carved it so this looks like it’s shaded like he took out that particular shape, and it’s hovering over it. Yeah. Can you appreciate how ridiculously riel that looks like? I mean, we went to extensive like we’ve we Okay. So, to to kind of help you guys understand how impressive this thing. First of all, you got to go check it out on on the post or on our on our social media, But we were pretty sure like that. This was that. This was stolen from something. Yeah, this feels like it is not if there is a contender for, you know, highly suspicious entry. It would be. This one did a reverse image. Church didn’t didn’t come up a lot of research. Did did research around the other info on it, the email that submitted it. And the only thing I can find is the reddit user that submitted this tow our art pretty much the same day that he submitted. It s so so. First of all, beautiful pumpkin. Second of all, I mean, it’s ah, just the whole concept is a concept to execution. Pull. Think. Very impressive, Jenna. What is our What’s our last entry? Um, besides brats. So Jessica got in right under the wire. Um, another patron that we love. Early Patron. This is one of the first. Yeah, she’s a starter of the 66 60 year. Yeah. Yeah. And, um, she submitted another great entry. This is another like three D one where it’s it’s really like a sculpture. It’s a scar. Fisher. Yeah. This is I am so envious of artistic people and like being able to being able to see something and within something normal, something cool within something normal and then, like, flesh it out like this is it’s like a It’s like she turned a pumpkin into a goblin face. Yeah, and it’s kind of nose and and crazy, crazy, like facial features like wrinkles. And yeah, it’s pupils and shit. Yeah, it’s great. And got got three D teeth and stuff. I mean, it’s really impressed, So I mean, the front runners are these last three. We got Jessica. We got Jared and Tina like it’s I mean, this city close, Bryce. I’m gonna I’m gonna say I think we’re both thinking. Um okay, here’s what I’m gonna say. Can we do a split on second place? Because Yeah, because I can’t. They’re both They’re both impressive and they both deserve hocus pocus by folks. This is what I’m saying. I mean, this is what I’m saying. Let’s let’s be honest. I can’t. They’re they’re impressive in their own right. For Or maybe we can when you can split hocus pocus by focus between them so half And after half of the year half of the year, Jessica can have focus, focus, focus On the other half of the year team they can have hocus pocus by foot will be silly brakes on taxi radio contact the the recording licensure. And we’ll just work out the logistics of splitting. That’s about that silly. What you do is instead, you just take the song, put it into an audio, enter and cut it in half. One gets the front first part and the other gets the second half. Okay, Okay. That makes sense. Right? Right. Right. So I must say, a two way tie between, um, between Jessica and Tina. Tina and that ends First place goes to Jared. Jared be just ridiculously good, Like Wow, Jerry. I mean, I’m still gonna have to email this guy and be like, Can we get some You legit. Can we get some applause for all of our entries? Except for Brad’s? Let’s get a round of applause from our studio audience. Thank you, Studio. You know, you guys were really usually very, very kind and well behaved respectful that, you know, you know, this is a controlled recording. Time to let it. This is it. Let us hear your appreciation for Jared. Thank you. That’s that’s that’s good. And indeed for all of our injured. Thank you. Everyone who participated in this, we sure do appreciate it, man. You give a mouse a cookie. Okay. All right. Please way. Keep it down. Way got the rest of the way. Mute the house mikes, please. We’ll make the house, Mike. All right, so congratulations, Jared. And Tina and Jessica will hear him in the back right now. They’re just They’re animals. We’ve improved. Well, that’s what you get when you have a rabid fan base. Um, now, let’s talk about Brad’s. I spent, like, five minutes trying to figure out what the fuck this was because I gave up, elected the description. Okay, Like so there’s two pumpkins in this picture and points out he’s like guys, mine is the shitty doesn’t say shitty. Mine is the one on the left. I was like, What is that? A pig? Cyclops? So it’s like, All right, so it’s got It’s like a circle and that has got, like, Globular, my son is normal and then it has It looks like a snout. It looks like a pig snout and some like Is that like a angry birds pig? Or like a very particular type of angered birds? Pig? Because it’s got the circle on the top that looks kind of like an eye, but it’s Thea negative space, but it’s hanging down the thing. It’s clear that he had high aspirations and 060 scale to execute a and then the side. There’s like the circles, too, but they could be arms. Yeah, I don’t know. It was It’s unclear. It looks almost like a like a Tetris game or something like that. Yeah, like are like are worded Tetris game. So here’s Here’s what he said in the comments, and we’ll have to do a side by side. We’ll have to pull a picture of this just so you can see it. You know, one against this the other. He said, Ah, mine is on the left and then in parentheses. Mario Mario Mushroom. Okay. And Kates, My wife is on the right. So he’s got now. Kate, yours is fine. I it is. It is a just a normal pumpkin entry, but Brad’s is uniquely retarded. Hand. God help you, big guy. I love you to death. But this man, you should give up on pump even if even if you have kids, they should hurt or, you know, Just don’t be so ambitious. Like, just start practicing. You don’t just do some triangle eyes and, like, just a smile. We’re gonna You know, my dad grows a tremendous amount of pumpkins everywhere, like just just off the charts. So, Brad, you’re perfectly welcome to come up here to Clark County, grab some Ah, grab some pumpkins and just practice away because you need it, buddy. So Brad was the very first entry in the pumpkin carving contest, and he was the only entry for, like, a week. And then we were sitting there like, Oh, God, if it’s only Brad Hawk and it’s just this is just gonna be a massacre. Brad wins the hocus pocus by focus with Erna and and the hocus focus girls. So anyways, thank you so much for for sharing and entering into the pumpkin carving contest. IOU beers buddy for for breaking over the girl beyond black Grand pumpkin car over and over. Uh, he’s a good guy. We’ve been assured that he’s he’s a good guy. He is. Yeah. Yeah, And if he’s not God help you because he’s the biggest motherfucker you’ve ever seen in your life. Yeah, he could probably kick my ass, but, um, it can’t cover pumpkin out out of, ah, wet paper bag. Maybe that was the problem. He’s like Andre, the giant level huge. You just startinto carve and then punched a hole throat with us. Yeah, you know, it’s like he’s holding it between his his ah, his index finger nous thumb. And he’s got this teeny, tiny little life that’s basically like playing with a doll set. And he’s just trying his hardest to be intricate. But he can’t because he’s so big and his face is so far away from his hands. It’s like I can’t see. Sorry, bread. Thanks for rendering. Thanks, everyone. And congratulations. Jessica, Tina and our first place winner, Jeer and Jared. You’ll be getting your brother. Oh, man, we really capitals in the me. Oh, yeah, we really appreciate everybody’s entry. So with that, with that, so we have That’s the end of our episode. Please. Again, check out our website at horror movie talk dot com. Please, please, please, please share the podcast with a friend. It’s the only way that we grow We don’t advertise And we’ve depended on listeners to steadily grow us, which is the worst so far. The good news is it’s worked so far, and we’re kind of reaching in the inflection point where we’re seeing like, yes, we’re getting a better trajectory on increased downloads. Um, check out our calls to action on a Web site. We’ve got the Amazon Associates button. If you’re planning on buying anything from Amazon the coming week, just click through the button and we’ll get a little taste of whatever you spend. And then, of course, our patron that we’ve patri on that. We’ve mentioned special thanks to all our pumpkin carving contest entries and special thanks, especially a special special specially to Dustin are ah, our ah post artist. Our resident artist who provides us with beautiful artwork and who does commissions if you if you have. Ah, you know, if you have art desires, he can He can fucking get you some art. Yeah, to be to be honest, we do not deserve Dustin. No, Um, so please support him and ah, use him on your projects and at D global d ah g o e b e l 00 on instagram. Yeah, um, and special thanks to all our patrons and yeah, do check out our do check out our latest blogged by Keith on the his top 10 favorite zombie types. It is a as as you’ve come to expect from Keith. It is a compendium, so check it out. It’s on. Ah, it’s on our website under the blog’s section. And with that, that is another episode of horror movie talk ended and we love you. What should we check out next week? Oh, yes. Oh, the coming weeks trying. We are doing the shining and I think that we can get my wife on the pod for that one. She has expressed interest in watching the Shining because she is interested in seeing Dr sleep, which will be not next week, but the week after. So check out the Shining. I don’t know where that’s available right now. Yeah, I mean, I might have problems dollars for it Now, I think I think it might actually be available on Netflix. Yeah, I would be. I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s free somewhere because Dr Sleep is coming out. I think it is on Netflix, so yeah, that’ll be exciting to talk about because I actually read, um, while the listen to the audio book, my wife would take issue with me saying I read it, but I listen to the audio book of both The Shining and Dr Sleep. I’m the last couple months and, uh, i’ll be able to talk about, you know, maybe a little bit more informed than I normally do, But not with good grammar. That’s all thinking about by Yeah, Roar